Welcome And What’s Coming Today

SPEAKER_05 0:07

Welcome to the intersection of faith and culture. It's the Wall Builder Show taking on the hot topics of the day from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective. Thanks for joining us on this Monday. A wonderful weekend for everybody. Lots of activity, lots of 250th events. We got Dr. Bob Pearl's going to be with us on the program today from Birchman Baptist in the Fort Worth area, where all three of us on the radio program have spoken there and a lot of our friends as well. Just a great church. Going to talk about the courageous church. But let's talk about a specific courageous church. Washington State? We're going to have good news on a Monday from Washington State because David and Tim got to go to the gorge and be a part of this incredible Rise of the Statesman event. Guys, I can't wait to hear about this.

SPEAKER_03 0:50

Well, and I'll clarify that my my dad did not get to make it because uh American Airlines did not think that was where they should direct the route planes. And so uh so he did not get and he was, I mean, granted, you know, dad, I think you were only gonna be able to be there for a couple hours on Friday anyway, uh, because you spoke Thursday night in Arkansas. You were supposed to speak uh Saturday morning, or I guess Saturday. Yeah, but morning, I guess is right, in Arizona. Uh and so we had worked out flight that we thought we could get him up there for a little bit, and uh so he could at least um come encourage Pastor Josh McPherson and some of our friends um that were up there. Uh Eric Metaxis was up there, Nate Shatzlein and good buddy, uh, and then uh Pastor Mark Driscoll and Russell Johnson and lots of other uh men and leaders that were up there anyway. Uh Dad, how many hours did y'all get delayed coming out of uh Arkansas? Was it like six hours you were delayed, I think?

SPEAKER_01 1:48

Yeah, pretty close to that. It was pretty close to six hours coming out of Arkansas, and they kept redoing stuff. And so instead of getting into Phoenix at a decent hour, we got in at, I don't know, is there an indecent hour? Our schedule seems to take 24 hours a day anyway. So it was a much later than what we anticipated, but the event was really good. Uh the events were good, and so I'm getting ready now to make an international flight. Um going from Dallas Fort Worth down to Houston, so I have to go through all the customs and do all the stuff you do with international flights. That's facetious, of course, because Houston is like its own country.

SPEAKER_05 2:23

I thought you meant Arkansas was another country, and you were flying in from Arkansas, so you had to go through customs.

SPEAKER_01 2:28

Yeah, well that that too. There are different customs between Texas and Arkansas for sure. But diff definitely different customs between Houston and anywhere else in the world.

FreedomCon At The Gorge Highlights

SPEAKER_03 2:38

Well, guys, I do want to back up and and brag on the event. Uh uh it was Freedom Conference, Freedom Con up at the Gorge in George, Washington. Uh our our friend Pastor Josh McPherson led that, and it it was absolutely incredible. This was a large men's conference on the Western Coast, I I think since 2003, I think it's the right number. Uh they had just under 5,000 men that were gathered. And you guys, we've talked a lot uh about the fact that we don't think we're just in a revival, we think there's an awakening. And this conference just further reiterated in my mind that confirming that idea that what we are seeing around us is not just uh people having a general interest in God or God reaching people on a general level. There is something much deeper where people are actually uh applying the word of God and where which we kind of differentiate a a revival is often inward and a awakening is often outward. So the awakening is just the next step of revival that you take what God has done inside of you and it spreads out out of you, so you go engage culture with the truth of the word of God, and and that is absolutely what these men were encouraged to do. Um guys, it was it was a a pretty unique uh collaboration, and there was a lot of jokes surrounding it, uh, because you have like some very reformed to uh very Pentecostal camps that came together, but it was all working to seek God's intervention and God's move, primarily Washington State, but then things that would flow from it. And uh for for Pastor Josh McPherson uh to be able to pull this off, that the the last time there was a group um this large up in Washington State was Promise Keepers, and that was twenty-something years ago. And uh the the thing that I told Pastor Josh, I wanted to be an encouragement to him, is you know, I I I think if you could have done something twenty-something years ago where you had an established name and brand like Promise Keepers, there wasn't the anti-Christian hostility to the extent there is today. Uh there wasn't the anti-Christian bias to the extent there is today. And then they had more than sixty-one days to be able to advertise, promote, and get people to sign up and come to this conference. And so what he was able to do, the the very first conference they've ever done like this, uh, where he had very little time to promote it, and in an era where he's trying to rally the men of Washington to come and and connect with God and take their faith and go and engage the culture. And he got nearly five thousand men to show up in in George, Washington at the gorgeous, incredible, beautiful outdoor venue and amphitheater. It was really, really impressive, guys. I I not only went to teach, uh, but there were definitely some things and moments when I felt God impressing things on me and encouraging me, and it was it was such a blessing for me to be there and be around those men. And then yesterday I spoke, uh did his services at his church and talked about the the role of pastors uh and and in the revolution, but also giving some some context that what happened in the Great Awakening caused the movement, and then there were pastors in the revolution that carried that movement to fruition, helped us become a nation, etc. etc. Uh and I I told this to his church. I think it's true that I I think he is one of those pastors right now that is one of those black robed regiment pastors. And guys, I'm encouraged because I am seeing more and more pastors. It seems like God is raising up to be those black robe regiment pastors. We mentioned our our friend Pastor Bob Pearl, we've all spoken at his church. He's been one of those guys very faithfully, uh, and courageously, boldly teaching the word of God and faith for a lot of a lot of years and decades, but it seems like now God is raising up a lot of new people to surround some of those faithful men who have been there, and there is a new hunger, desire, passion stirring happening. And and I want to say this for anybody listening, if you are in a state and you're thinking, Man, I I don't know if God's really doing a lot in my state, I want to encourage you that in Washington State, they are seeing the undercurrent of a revival and a great awakening happening.

Revival Versus Awakening In Public Life

SPEAKER_03 6:51

God is moving all over this nation. And so I I want to encourage you, even if you don't maybe feel it where you are, that guys, the benefit we have getting travel so much, we we see so much of what's happening around the country, and so we're not inundated and overwhelmed with uh what the media we see on social media or mainstream, whatever it is, because we see on the ground what's happening and God actually moving. And I want to encourage everybody, wherever you are, God is on the move, even though it might not feel like it in the moment.

SPEAKER_05 7:23

Yeah, and Washington State's one of the worst what had been one of the worst ones, so to have that revival there

Security Restrictions And A Wild Detail

SPEAKER_05 7:28

is really, really, really encouraging. And I I know I should ask a spiritual question, Tim, but my my burning question is with Chad Robashaw, Nick Freitas, and John Lovell there, did any of them tackle you and take you to the ground? Because I'm assuming that had to have happened at some point.

SPEAKER_03 7:43

So uh no, uh they actually uh I I had a uh all of us we had a security uh detail assigned to us uh because the nature of Washington State, um, where not everybody gets to carry guns and actually in the Gorge amphitheater, uh like they they wouldn't they wouldn't even let uh off-duty police officers have guns, etc. Like it was it was it was a whole deal. It was so communistic, Marxist, and in the way I felt about it. But they assigned me somebody um who was foreign special ops, um, who had I I I won't say the country, uh, because I don't want to give away all his details, but um he he was the Queen's Royal Guard, um and uh he was assigned to me. And so I I honestly said I wish one of the guys would try to come mess with me just so I could be like, hey, I need your help, and I want to see I want to see you deal with them. Um it did not happen, um, but I really yes, it it would have been so fascinating to me. I said I I told him, I said, honestly, I kind of want to go pick a fight with somebody just to see what you would do to them. Um it felt like you're hanging out with like a Chuck Norris kind of person, right? And you're like, I just want to see Chuck Norris roundhouse kick somebody in the head. Like, that's all I want to see right now. That's how it felt with this guy. Um, but no, unfortunately, I did not get to to grapple. I was not taken down. My security detail did not have to intervene. Um, but it was super fun um getting to connect with some of the guys up there.

SPEAKER_05 9:09

Well, we're glad you're back safe, Tim, and uh and that you had that kind of protection uh uh from your friends, uh, which are it's fun to watch you guys uh grapple on the ground, but didn't get to do it this time. Anyway, quick break,

A Patriot Pastor Trains His Church

SPEAKER_05 9:21

we'll be right back. Dr. Bob Pearl's gonna join us when we return. You're listening to the Wall Builder Show.

SPEAKER_02 9:32

This is Tim Barton from Wall Builders with another moment from American history. American patriot Paul Revere wrote to alert Americans of the impending arrival of the British, but he also stopped Patriot leaders Samuel Adams and John Hancock to warn them that the British were staking their execution. Adams and Hancock were staying with the Reverend Jonas Clark in Lexington. When they asked Pastor Clark if his church was ready for the approaching British, he replied, I've trained them for this very hour. They will fight and, if need be, die under the shadow of the house of God. Later that morning, 70 men from his church faced several hundred British in the first battle of the war for independence. As Pastor Clark affirmed, the militia that morning were the same who filled the pews of the church meeting house on the Sunday morning before. The American church was regularly at the forefront of the fight for liberty. For more information on this pastor and other colonial patriots, go to wallbuilders.com.

Bob Pearl Defines A Courageous Church

SPEAKER_05 10:32

Welcome back to the Wallbuilder Show. Thanks for staying with us. We got Bob Pearl with us, Dr. You know, you're like John Witherspoon. You have to call Witherspoon the Reverend Dr. John Witherspoon. So I'm gonna call you the Reverend Dr. Bob Pearl Birchman Baptist. It's good to see you, brother. Thanks for coming on.

SPEAKER_00 10:47

Good to see you.

SPEAKER_05 10:47

Thank you for having me. Well, I'm excited about your book, Courageous Church. We are, you know, of course, at Wall Builders constantly working with pastors that are courageous, but also trying to get more of them to be courageous. And you're teaching them how to do that in this book. So thank you for doing the book. Thank you for being a pastor that does this. I could feel it in your church. You know, you just have a you have a congregation that is salt and light. They're not sitting around being sugary and dull. They're salt and light. So you could write the book because you're doing it at your church.

SPEAKER_00 11:16

Well, it's important for us to understand that uh we have a responsibility here in America. We have been given many, many blessings and freedoms from God. And we have a responsibility to follow in the steps of our forefathers, not just in our country, but even as a Baptist, following the in the steps of our Baptist forefathers who were courageous, that gave their lives for certain truths of Scripture. And so that's the same thing that we see in the founding of our country, how they gave their lives, and then those who serve our country, how they have given their lives for the freedoms that we enjoy.

SPEAKER_05 11:59

Well, and you give that history in the book. You go back to the early church, the reformation, courage on American soil. You walk through all that so that we can know we stand on good, solid ground. The only problem I have with the book, I love the fact that Jack Hebs did the forward, but you got this guy named Tim Barton that did a did a uh a recommendation in the book. I don't know if we can if we can be I'm kidding. He's uh he's yeah, he's he's a great guy.

SPEAKER_04 12:21

He you know, he Tony Perkins, Ryan from from uh Liberty, Ryan Heilfenbraum, Eric Metaxas. You got a lot of great folks in here, right?

SPEAKER_00 12:29

Yeah, and and all these guys too have been at our church.

SPEAKER_04 12:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:33

And our church, I want to make sure that our people are exposed to these kinds of voices in our culture that are willing to stand and and to remind us of the blessing and responsibility we have.

SPEAKER_05 12:48

I I don't think this is just for pastors, though. This is for all of us. We need to know when our pastor speaks on this that they're standing on solid ground as well. So it's a great gift to a pastor, I would say. I would encourage people to give it to their pastor to encourage them to be courageous, but we in the church need to know this stuff too.

SPEAKER_00 13:03

Right. This was not written simply at a pastors, yeah. This was written for everyone, particularly people in the pew, and more particularly for those who claim to be believers, because it it very clearly shows our biblical responsibility. And this was written to be an easy read, it's not uh an academic book, it's just was written uh as God put it on my heart to encourage people to stand. You know, cor courage actually can be contagious.

SPEAKER_05 13:38

It can, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:39

Just like fear can be contagious. Yeah and so when people who want to speak up, they feel like, oh, I can't or something. When someone next to them speaks up, it gives them courage. And this is what I'm trying to do is raise up courageous

Why “Political” Issues Are Biblical

SPEAKER_00 13:56

people. And I talk about the church because I, as a pastor, believe that the social pathologies that we have in our country are because pastors have abrogated their biblical responsibility in preaching the truth and standing for truth, and they have swallowed that lie that you're not supposed to talk about politics and all that. Well, it's not politics, these are biblical issues. Abortion is not a political issue, it's a biblical issue. Transgender is a biblical issue, marriage is a biblical issue, and it's not that the church is getting in the path of the state, it's that the state is encroaching upon the responsibility of the church. And just because people in the the quote state say it, you've got pastors that are afraid to stand. And you know, people in the church, if they'll get this and read it, they can give a copy to their pastors and say, Pastor, I believe that that you could uh help us in this and call our people to stand.

SPEAKER_05 15:04

Yeah, and say, Pastor, I but I believe you're courageous. I want to give this to you as a tool to help with that courage. You you said that you know that that most of our societal, or really every one of our societal ills, is a result of the church uh abrogating the responsibility. It's almost instead of being salt, that you will because the salt wasn't there, the meat is spoiling. You look out there in the in the culture and you see all these problems, but they do, they stem from the church not being there to preserve the culture.

SPEAKER_00 15:28

Well, Jesus also said we're the light of the world. You ought to put a basket over the light, and that's what's happened. I think too many churches have a basket over them and they're not letting their light shine in the world because light exposes, just like salt helps enhance flavor. Yeah, uh, light exposes darkness.

SPEAKER_05 15:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:51

And so, you know, we've all been been around when you're in the yard or something, and there's a brick that's been in the grass for a long time, and it's the sun is shining, and you move the brick, you notice all of the critters underneath there run to the darkness. Well, that's what light does, it exposes the evils and and all in our society and why it is important for believers and p pastors in particular to stand and declare that light.

SPEAKER_05 16:22

Amen. I I saw uh on Amazon you have both the Kindle version and a and a and a printed version. Where do you want people to go to Amazon to your website? Where's the best place to go to get it?

SPEAKER_00 16:31

Probably it's just easier to go to Amazon that's faster and everything. Most people have uh accounts with Amazon and that's easy to easy to do.

Standing Together And Rebuilding Community

SPEAKER_05 16:41

You you know the the you've got a chapter in here about standing together, courage, and community, finding other people that that will also stand, or even being the one to start that, like you're saying, and it and it be courageous. A friend of mine that's a pastor in in Vegas of all places, he said something to me a few weeks ago that has stuck with me. He said, You know, iron sharpening iron is so important, but you can't sharpen iron with a marshmallow marshmallow. That's right. That's like that's what I thought of when I read that chapter in your book. I'm like, you've got to get around some other iron, or you've got to be iron yourself.

SPEAKER_00 17:09

That's right. And that's the thing. Uh, as people see leaders and their pastors and others in community standing, it encourages them to stand. Yeah. And because it it paves the way for them. And so it says, hey, I can do that because most people uh know what's right to do. They just need encouragement to do it. And know they're not alone. That's that's right.

SPEAKER_05 17:38

And the church really was the epicenter of the community in the founding of this country. It was the place where everything emanated uh from that, and we sort of seeded that ground. Do you sense that there's there's some waking up and an effort to reinsert ourselves into the culture as we should have? Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00 17:54

In the founding of our country, you know, what they did, the first thing that they did was build a church.

SPEAKER_05 18:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:00

And the community was built to built around that church. And what happens then? They they came there for worship, but then when they had their their meetings of the community, what we would call government meetings or organizational meetings of the community, any community problem, where'd they meet? In the church. It was all in the church. The church was the center of the community. And that's the way it should be. Now, today we have we we have lost that emphasis. Yeah. And so this is the one thing that I'm pushing to try to realize uh get people to realize that we need to put the priority back into our biblical responsibility in the church. Amen. Amen. The church is the only uh institution that God has given a promise of perpetuity. Governments are gonna be gone, the church is gonna always be here. Wow. Uh para parachurch organizations, as good as they are, they're gonna be gone. They come and go. The Lord's church, the gates of hell, will never prevail against

Texas Marriage And Family Commission Plans

SPEAKER_00 19:13

it.

SPEAKER_05 19:13

Before I let you go, tell us a little bit about uh your new gig. Uh the governor has appointed you to a commission you're you're a part of now.

SPEAKER_00 19:20

Yes, uh I've been very privileged. The governor has uh appointed me to this Texas Commission on Marriage and Family. And that goes because of some of my involvement there when uh when the Supreme Court redefined the definition of marriage, that now it's not just between one man and one woman, and they usurp their responsibility because that's the church's responsibility. I said then I no longer recognize the government's involvement or or uh understanding of marriage. And so I had submitted through my representatives some some uh marriage proposals, and because of that, other people had done some things, and so the legislators of marriage to someone.

SPEAKER_05 20:16

No. Yeah, when changing when you I submitted marriage proposals to some state legislators. Yeah, yeah, no, no. Obviously, some ideas, some proposals.

SPEAKER_00 20:26

Some ideas, some ways we can turn the trying to put marriage back into the centrality of the church, getting it out of government hands and going back to where it was before the government got involved in it. And so as a result, there were other um uh i introductions to bills and so forth relative to marriage and family and so forth. So the legislature passed this uh uh law establishing this commission. And so the governor appoints three, the lieutenant governor appoints two, and the speaker appoints two, and I was fortunate enough to be appointed by the defense.

SPEAKER_05 21:08

And so you guys will spend the next year researching, getting together, working on these proposals that potentially could become legislation at the session.

SPEAKER_00 21:16

We are we are to look to make recommendations to the next legislative session on uh on the issues with marriage and family.

SPEAKER_05 21:24

I I wish we did more of this having pastors involved in that in that process. And of course, we've got a handful of pastors in Congress and state legislatures, but man, I love the fact that you're doing that, Dr. Bell. That's a that's a fantastic. It says a lot about our our legislature creating that commission, your willingness to go down there and and be involved for for years you've done this, for decades, you've literally been in this arena helping to be salt and light, and not not saying to yourself, Oh, well, I'm only gonna worry about my church and my family. You've actually paid attention to the to the community as well by getting involved in what's going on with the state. So thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

Thank you. And I just see that as my responsibility as a pastor.

SPEAKER_05 21:58

Yeah, amen. I hope other The pastors will do the same. The courageous church, standing boldly for truth in a cowardly world, forwards by Jack Kibbs. Bob Pearl. Go get it at uh Amazon.com. I know David and Tim send their best. They love you, and uh we appreciate you coming on the program. Thank you. I appreciate this opportunity. Stay with us, folks. We'll be right back with David and Tim Barton.

How To Bring WallBuilders To You

SPEAKER_02 22:23

Hey, this is Tim Barton with Wall Builders. And as you've had the opportunity to listen to Wall Builders Live, you've probably heard the wealth of information about our nation, about our spiritual heritage, about the religious liberties, about all the things that makes America exceptional. And you might be thinking, as incredible as this information is, I wish there was a way that I could get one of the wall builders' guys to come to my area and share with my group, whether it be a church, whether it be a Christian school or public school or some political event or activity. If you're interested in having a wall builder speaker come to your area, you can get on our website at www.wallbuilders.com and there's a tab for scheduling. And if you'll click on that tab, you'll notice there's a list of information from speakers' bios to events that are already going on. And there's a section where you can request an event to bring this information about who we are, where we came from, our religious liberties and freedoms. Go to the wall builders website and bring a speaker to your area.

Measuring Growth And Ending With Hope

SPEAKER_05 23:25

Welcome back to the Wall Builder Show. Thanks for staying with us. Thanks to Dr. Bob Pearl for joining us here on the Wall Builder Show, back with David and Tim. And uh man, yeah, you said it at the beginning of the program, Tim, just you know, guys like Dr. Pearl that have been out there in the trenches for decades, you know, tilling the ground, sowing the seeds, and now to see the kind of fruit and the pastors like Josh and others that you talked about, it's an exciting time to see what's happening in the church all over the country, as you said, not just red areas.

SPEAKER_01 23:51

Yeah, and and notice too that what Bob was covering was the same thing where Tim was talking about earlier, the difference between a revival and and an awakening. Because so much of what Bob was covering was, hey, apply this stuff to the community, apply this to the culture, apply this outside the church. Stop doing this stuff only inside the church. And he has been in the middle of that battle. I mean, in his specific particular denomination, he has been holding them to the line for a number of years, uh, particularly back under COVID days, and then even since then, as they've tried to be more woke and as as they say, be more open to other beliefs and thoughts. He said, nope, you stay right where the Bible is. And he has been unrelenting in that, and now it's interesting, and I think it's happening fairly rapidly, we're seeing more and more turn back in that biblical direction. And even what his denomination was recommending three or four years ago is now kind of frowned on by most people in that denomination, although it was really well accepted. And as Tim was talking earlier, I was I was thinking back in the first part of the program, that we had a tradition and in at home when I was growing up, and I was a I was a little guy. I mean what when I was playing high school basketball, I was at four foot seven, okay? I weighed eighty-two pounds, and so I'm a point guard. I I am really, really, really tiny. The first day I had in high school, the center came by, he didn't know who I was, but he just picked me up and set his own shoulder like with one hand. And I I I rode to class the first day up on his shoulder. So I was just a tiny, tiny, tiny guy in school. And so for me, growing up was a big deal. I wanted to I wanted to grow at some point. And so what would happen is his dad, he would get put me against uh the door frame and one of the doors, and he would put a a f a a frame of square on top of my head and a pencil, and he would mark on the door how w how tall I was at that point, and he'd put a date beside it. And so maybe three months later I'd grown in half an inch, and and maybe two years later I'd grown an inch and a half. And it was always being able to measure and see. And and so when you're in the house, I didn't feel like I was growing ever, but every once in a while I got this measurement where it says, Oh, I have grown some. That's cool. And I kind of think that's what it is with the church right now. We're we go there every day or every week, or we're doing this all the time. And we really we're so close we don't see the growth. But I think there are some milestones along the way that show us that America really is getting into a great awakening, and I think that's a great place to be, uh, whether it's with what Bob Pearl is doing in his denomination or what Tim experienced this weekend in Washington State or what we see as we travel. I think it's a great time for America.

SPEAKER_05 26:25

Yeah, very exciting to see. It's all over the country. I think what Tim said earlier is so important, no matter where you are. Don't be discouraged. Wherever God's planted you, you fight where you are, you stand for truth, you give of your life fortune, sacred honor throughout this 250th. And let's watch that revival happen in all 50 states. Thanks for listening to the Wall Buller Show.