Rick Green [00:00:07] This is the Intersection of Faith and Culture. It's the WallBuilders Show. Thanks for joining us today on New Year's Day, guys. So, we're gonna do a Foundations of Freedom Thursday on New Years Day. What a great way to start 2026 and the 250th birthday of our nation going back to the foundations and letting people ask questions about the foundational principles that made America great in the first place. Rick Green here with David Barton and Tim Barton. Happy New Year, guys! 

Tim Barton [00:00:31] Happy New Year! And what a novel thought to say we're gonna, we're gonna help people make a New Year's resolution to actually maybe know and study the Constitution this year. We would also encourage like biblical thoughts, historic thoughts, but certainly it seems like a great way to start the new year by saying, well, what's constitutional? What should we be doing in America and not? And then we'll throw in, of course, some historic and biblical thoughts as well. But yeah, great way to start the new year. 

David Barton [00:00:58] And, you know, guys, I know this is Thursday. It's a Foundation Freedom Thursday, but this is already Friday for me. I'm gonna start this off with good news. There's only 358 days left of Christmas. So we've got good news Friday going on a Thursday. So, I got all sorts of good news today to mix them with the foundations. 

Rick Green [00:01:15] You know, I think I forgot to say Merry Christmas yesterday. I think I failed us. We had, you know, we were so excited to be, you know, talking about the new David movie and Brian being with us. Did anybody say Merry Christmas yesterday? I think we. 

Tim Barton [00:01:28] Rick new year's resolution. Merry Christmas every day. You're starting over. 

Rick Green [00:01:32] All right. Starts today. All right, all right. We'll see. Okay. All right guys. Well, we've got some great questions, actually some good foundational questions too, so that we do start the year actually studying civics and figured out. Who we are as a nation in our 250th birthday. So, we're gonna start with Leslie from Tyler, Texas, sent in a question that says, I first want to thank you guys for all the work you do in obeying God's call in your lives. I was homeschooled starting in second grade. I now homeschool my children. Even with being homeschool, I'm still learning things about our founding and founders that I don't recall being taught. I want my children to have a firmer understanding of our founders. Even though I spend hours in selecting their curriculum, I still think I'm coming up short in this area of their education. What books? Do or did you use to teach your children about America's founders? Is there a curriculum in this area that is better than others, or do you prefer other individual books to this? A list would be much appreciated by myself for elementary through high school. May God continue to bless your work and your lives. Leslie, God bless you. And thank you for writing that in. And believe me, I was homeschooled, homeschool my kids. They're now homeschooling their kids. And we still learn every single day. It's one of the reasons I love getting to do this program. Cause quite literally every day on wall builders, I'm learning something new about the founders, the founding documents or principles. So, we so appreciate your attitude and the tone with which you asked your question. Honestly guys, just basically saying we're lifelong learners and there's some good resources out there. There's some bad ones too. So what's the best way for us to steer people in the short time we have on the program today. 

David Barton [00:03:04] You know, I'm going to open up by talking just a little bit about pedagogy just a little, and that I don't think that we need to copy what is the 20th century pedagogy for education and say, let's do that as Christians. I kind of would back up and say hey, the way we've been doing it for the last hundred years, is that really the best way to teach? Is that the best to do education? And you know, while I can point to Christian curriculums are out there and some Christian textbooks that are good, I would encourage something actually kind of really different and I would encourage that in the way I mean, we were just talking yesterday about the movie David and it's such a story-based movie. I mean you take two entire books out of the Bible. I don't know. That's probably 60 chapters cause they're fairly long books and you look at all the incidents in David's life and you could preach five years exposition just on the life of David. But you get a hour and a half story on the theater and it really creates in your mind who David is. And then things kind of fit or don't fit, because wait a minute, that doesn't sound like the character of David. I don't think that's, and it's easier to put things together once you know who they are. So, what I would recommend is that you go back and rather than teaching history the way we've done it in the 20th century, which is dates, names, and places, that you do it the way the Bible does it and that's storytelling. You go back and the story of Sampson, the story David and Goliath, the story, not just David and Goliath but the story and David and the story of Samuel and the story of Moses and the story of Job and all these stories that there and it makes it so much more alive and you connect with them as real people rather than just as dates, names, places. So, I would recommend that you just back up and kind of start doing history by reading storybooks, history storybooks. And there's a lot of those out there. Actually, WallBuilders, we have two series of biographical history books. We've got a Sower Series and we've got a second series that are just biographies of great American heroes, whether it be the Wright brothers. And yes, you're not gonna get all of history that way. But once you establish a biographical connection, I really thank God made us that way and we know that because we respond to testimonies. When we hear somebody else's testimony, or the scripture says you overcome by the word of your testimony, when you're telling your story, that's what people connect to, and that's why people say, hey, I can be inspired by that story, whatever that is. And so, I would encourage, you know, if you wanna get a traditional curriculum out there, there's some good Christian school curriculums, and you know Abeka's been one that's been reliable through the years, and there are others as well. But I would say you don't have to necessarily follow that. Take some of those, go to WallBuilders and get those two series of biographical histories and just go through and do a bunch of history kind of stuff. Read the histories, talk about people, talk about what you can see in those lessons and just have discussions over it and I think you'll find that to be really, really, really productive in doing that. So that would be my encouragement is not necessarily get a Christian curriculum although there are definitely those out there. I would say just kind of mix it up and just change the pedagogy a bit. And do more about stories and more about people and more looking at their stories. And as you do that, then you can get online and say, hey, what are some good, I don't know, World War II stories or what are good stories about really cool pioneer women from history or whatever and start looking at those stories. As you start telling the story, you start seeing the context of the time, like we were talking yesterday about the movie David. When you start going through David, you'll ask the question, who are the Amalekites? They kept showing up in this in this David movie yesterday. Who are they and who are the Philistines? And just going into the story leads you into all sorts of rabbit trails that help you get history and they help you put it in context. And the pieces fit together a whole lot better when you can see it around somebody's story. So that would be my big recommendation is going that direction. And, you know, again, don't feel like you have to be bound to what everybody else is doing today. You're gonna find out your kids have been made in a way that God has made them and they're gonna respond to those stories and they are gonna do well and you're gonna see that the testing results do well as well as just your kids doing well. 

Rick Green [00:07:30] Yeah. And I think honestly, David, that's how you broke me of my dislike of history because that was exactly what you described as what I disliked was just memorizing dates, names or places. And you started putting out with WallBuilders, these stories, and you started, you know, really letting us see history through the eyes of the people that lived it. And it's absolutely the better way to learn. And I would just add to that, that, you know take them to the places when you can and, and, you find some good, if you can't travel across the country, find some historical sites in your community or your state. Because it really does help bring it to life when you can walk in those footsteps and you can go to those battlefields or museums or whatever it might be. It helps your kid, you know, helps the child to fall in love with history and keeps it from being boring. 

Tim Barton [00:08:11] And guys, I would add one more thought as well, looking for resources. Obviously, last week we had our good friend Bill Federer on Christmas, telling the story of St. Nick. Bill is another guy who has done a lot of storytelling over the years and that's another good resource for people. So, between WallBuilders, Patriot Academy, Bill Federer's site, American Minute, and guys, even PragerU is starting to do some stuff. Prager U Kids, where they're telling stories. And so, I think, and we talked about it yesterday, some with David, I think there's a resurgence a little bit of some of the storytelling and maybe a recapture of some of the actual heroes, genuine heroes that should be remembered and celebrated and honored in many ways. And so, I do think there are a lot of good sources or at least some good sources that are available and accessible that will have both things that students can watch some places like PragerUKids has some activity sheets. And then, of course, there's all kinds of books and resources and other things as well at all those various websites. But I do think there is a growing movement in voice, Dad, kind of to your point of recapturing this storytelling. And I think maybe even, Rick, you certainly can speak to this some. You've done a lot of homeschool conventions over the last several years, maybe the last couple of decades. Dad, I know you did those when we were growing up. Rick, I think you've been carrying that mantle now for a couple of decades to these homeschool conventions. But it does seem like with the growth of the homeschool movement, one of the things that is also growing is the resurgence of stories and storytelling. And so, there are more websites and more voices that are telling these stories. So, I think there's some good options out there. 

David Barton [00:09:52] You know, I want to pick up Rick on something you mentioned too, even going to see the sites, when you said that I had a flashback to a couple of sites. But one was in Vicksburg, Mississippi and the siege of Vicksberg. I don't quote me on this. I think it was like 55 days that the union Navy bombarded the Confederate town of Vicksberg and Tim, you may remember this, but we went into in town and saw some of those houses. And some of those houses still had the cannonballs embedded in them from 55 days of shelling. And I remember seeing black and white pictures of the town from that period of time. And as you look up main street, I don't know that there wasn't a square foot that didn't have a cannon ball laying in it somewhere. And I just thought, what would it have been like to be there for 55 days? And you know, a lot of the people hid in caves outside of town along the river and, and they've resurrected an old Delta boat that, that was part of that. And just going through and seeing that man it made that part of the civil war really be visually alive for me just going to the place would happen to see in some of the old stuff there 

Tim Barton [00:10:58] Well, Dad and Rick, I know one of the cautions that you guys have said, too, is one of challenge at times with some of the National Park Service. Even though it's great to go learn the stories, sometimes you'd have to be careful of what the guides are telling you or of what some of signs have said. Dad, we have done a couple tours over the last year or two where we've actually led some people on tours and we've had to give them maybe the Paul Harvey, like the rest of the story of what wasn't being said or maybe redirect from what was being said? Because even though it is, Rick, to your point, it's so great to go and visit those locations. Sometimes you need to do some outside research before you get there. Some places, the Rangers of Park Service were awesome. They did a really good job telling the story. But then there were some where you could see they've been woke-ified a little bit. And so that that is a caution. But dad, backing up to cannonballs, I definitely remember going to a lot of those sites. But the one that stands out in my brain the most with cannonballs is Thomas Nelson, Jr.'s house in Yorktown. Because that has Cannonball still on the side. And for people that are listening, if you want to look this up, Thomas Nelson Jr. signer of the declaration and his whole story. That's such a fun story from Yorktown where he's telling men, fire onto my house and not to get into that. Look it up. It's great. But you also can look up pictures of cannonball's Thomas Nelson Jr home. And it has cannonballs from the revolution still stuck in his home that is there from the Revolution. So that's the one I remember the most. I'm sure, dad, with how many sites we saw as kids growing up, if we went back and revisited them, I would remember a lot more of these. I think probably, unfortunately, a lot of them ran together in my head as a kid. But certainly, it made history and traveling way more fun to go to those sites. 

Rick Green [00:12:46] And for those of you that can't go or are, you know, not going to be able to go anytime soon, go to wallbuilders.com, get some of those materials, bring that history to life. One of the materials there is Chasing American Legends. It's a, it's basically a reality show where we were taking our kids to those history places. And so you can kind of see it and experience it, or your kids can through the eyes of our kids. So it's a it's, a fun way to do that. So, lots of great tools there. Check that out at wallbuilder.com. Let's take a quick break, guys. We've got more questions coming up on this foundation is a freedom Thursday on New Year’s Day. You're listening to the WallBuilders show. 

Rick Green [00:14:23] Welcome back to The WallBuilders Show. Thanks for staying with us on this Foundations of Freedom Thursday on New Year's Day and once again Happy New Year. Let's go to another Leslie. So, our last question was from Leslie and now a different Leslie says, are we a republic or a democracy? We keep hearing so-and-so is a threat to our democracy. Is this an inaccurate use of the term? Guys, I kind of you know when people say I'm a threat to democracy i tend to respond by saying yes because didn't the founders hate democracy and love a constitutional republic? 

Tim Barton [00:14:57] Yeah, I would love to know which founding father do you think supported democracy, right? Like I, I'm just curious because I'm pretty sure the founding fathers were a threat to democracy as well. That's why the constitution says that we're a Republic and actually a condition of joining our nation when other states and territories joined was they had to have a Republican form of government that the pledge of allegiance was, to the Republic for which it stands, that there there's nothing that goes democracy. So that This is not a new accusation and actually Dad, I do think that this could be something that's far more strategic and it could even be a little sinister to some extent, where one of the tactics of Marxists and often socials and communists use some of the same idea, they try to do an undermining, a demeaning, a belittling of something they oppose or disagree with. And so, I think, again, this is... May be broader, but I do think that there are some people that call America democracy because this is what they've heard a long time. They're not familiar with the concept of republic or the fact that in a republic, there are actually elections where people are voting and therefore, they're like, well, if we all vote, that's a democracy. Except in a democracy, there's not bounding constraints necessarily of a constitution number one, and number two... In a democracy, then it's the rule of the mob, which is what the Founding Fathers certainly were against for lots of reasons and lots of examples we can show in their writings of the opposition to the influence or mood of the Mob. But Dad, what are your thoughts? Is this something, do you see this maybe as something that's been more strategic? We talk about the demonization of the Founding Fathers has been going on for 60, 70 years, and that's probably been quite strategic. Because if you can demonize the Founding Fathers, then, when you attack things like the Constitution, or the Declaration, the Bill of Rights, etc., you can argue that's fruit of the poisonous tree because the Founding Fathers are bad, then what they did was bad. Let's get rid of all of this. Is this maybe the same tactic being used against the notion that we're a republic, and so people pretend like we're not? They ignore it or say we're something different. 

David Barton [00:17:14] Yeah, you know, it's significant. I think that it's kind of both. It's strategic on their part, but then everybody picks it up, including those that are not necessarily enemies. And so, oh, the Founding Fathers were atheist, agnostics, deists. Well, everybody who says that's not an enemy, but the people who started that lie, they were enemies. And now they've got that lie embedded so into the culture that people believe that. And we're gonna even talk about some of that tomorrow on Good News Friday. How that people believe that and what it does. Now we're having some people kind of stand up and say, no, no, they're not atheist, agnostics, and it's kind of like, well, you're radical to say they're not, but the people who came up with that first lie, yeah, they had bad intentions, I'm convinced, and now it's just everybody's kind of gotten into it, and I think the same thing with democracy, I'm working with a bunch of scholars right now on standards in Texas, and these guys are really good. They're conservatives, and they keep saying, and hey, we got to point out how important the democracy is. No, no, let's point out how important article four is that we cannot have a democracy, that we have to be a republic. And so that's like even new to some of those conservative professors. Well, and dad, this is a question. 

Tim Barton [00:18:23] And you said a lot of the scholars you're working with are conservative. And I'm just curious, because I think from conversations we've had that some of them maybe aren't like super conservative, they're just intellectually honest. So maybe they're like, sometimes we talk about if someone's theologically conservative, they believe in biblical traditional values. I'm wondering, is this the same thing where they're historically conservative? Or are you referring to a political ideology or just the fact that they're intellectually honest? Because again, I think there's some of them that you weren't totally sure like what side of the aisle necessarily they're on, but they're supporting some of the true things in history, whether or not they, you know, maybe vote the same way we do or not. 

David Barton [00:19:08] Yeah, it was actually both. There were some of the props that I don't know how conservative they are, but they came out with the wrong, but there are some that were definitely, I know we're conservative and they came up with the wrong and you know, we talked about important on this. Oh, okay. And, and just going back to that, this is where I think it's so important for every citizen. And by the way, Texas is moving in the right direction. The new standards that we have won't be out for a couple of years, but we're going to have kids studying the constitution all the way through all the grade levels. So, when you get done, we're going to say, what does article one do? What does article two do? Are there seven articles in the constitution? Every citizen should know what each article does in general terms. You know, one's about the legislative branch. Two is about the executive branch. Three is about. The judicial branch. Four is about a Republican form of government. Four is what knocks out democracy. Five is how to amend the constitution. Six is the federal supremacy clause. Seven is the attestation clause. We used to know those seven simple points and we're gonna get kids back to that Lord willing, but that's a really big thing is knowing those seven points. But the other thing I'll throw out is there's seven different forms of government and we cover this in the Founder's Bible as well in different forms in government. And the founding fathers disliked all the others except a Republican form of government, which is why they specified that in the Constitution. So, it's not like they didn't know what a democracy was, they did and they hated i worse than they hated monarchy, worse than they hate totalitarianism, they hated democracies because they called it a mobocracy. 

Tim Barton [00:20:37] Well, I, I do wonder too, guys, if part of the reason there's a push for democracy is when, when people say we're democracy, part of the argument is that everybody has a voice and everybody's voice should be heard and everybody voice matters. Part of why I think there's this push is when you look at the fact that under Biden, for example, we had largely open borders. And so right now we, we of course have seen all of the fraud up in Minnesota and man, you talk about some of the crazy stuff, Nick Shirley, what he is exposed up in Minnesota and now there's people all over the nation and various states saying hey, look at the stuff in our state too. We know it's not just Minnesota, although it's incredibly bad in Minnesota, but like in California, we know what Gavin Newsom has been doing and also, we know that with population that the way that congressional seats are divvied up is based on the population of the state and the population of the State is not necessarily limited to just the citizens, legal US citizens that are in that state. And so, I do wonder if part of this push toward the democracy is if there are states saying, hey, we're going to let all these people not legal US Citizens into our state and then they're pushing for democracy. They would say, well, it's not right that we wouldn't let everybody have a voice because we're a democracy and every voice matters. I wonder if it's not only strategic to change the Constitution to go more for a mob led where they feel like they might can manipulate the emotions for votes where they want to but also if this is something that maybe gives them the ability. To sway and influence future elections by saying we should let everybody vote whether they're legal or not because they're all people and all people matter and voices matter and votes matter and we're a democracy. I wonder if this is going to be part of the strategy we see implemented going forward. I know we've seen it a little bit at the state level. I'd love to know what you guys think. Is this maybe part of part of this strategy that we have seen in some of these liberal states? 

David Barton [00:22:41] I think it's part of the strategy for sure. I think that's part of the strategy because that's what they want. I mean, right now, if you're a Democrat, what benefit is there to being a U.S. Citizen because you want everybody to have everything the U. S. has and you bring them in and you let them vote and you let them get all the money and you don't have any accountability. Just send them, give them all the money you can. We're seeing that with all these various states. By the way, I was surprised to see is it eight states now? That have Somalian fraud going on in the states, including Texas, that they have uncovered the Somalian groups in Texas that are getting money. And so now that they're starting to look at Minnesota, they're just starting to, you know, this sounds racist, but they're started to look at the Somalians charities, and at these Somalian charities, and they've got this thing down to a science raking in money in all these different states. Now, fortunately here in Texas, we've got very aggressive attorney general, not gonna put up with that if he can find it. So, I just say that to say, what benefit is there if you're a Democrat to being a citizen? It means absolutely nothing, except it gives us votes. It gives us more votes to do what we want to do. You keep us in power. And I think, Tim, you're right on that. I do think that this is one of the most dangerous things out there. As a matter of fact, a couple of years ago, when I was asked to help write standards for a different state, I said, well, here's the top seven things your kids have got to know when they get out of school in this state. And one of them is that America is not a democracy, that we are republic. That's the only way you can keep the rule of law. Once you go to democracy, you lose the rule of law, and once you lose the rule-of-law, you just lose the due process rights in the Constitution, and this is the other thing that we're seeing with federal judges right now, is they're giving all these illegal immigrants the same rights that citizens are getting. You can't deport an illegal immigrant without having due process and trial. No, wait a minute, those are the rights that go with citizens. Those aren't rights that go to human rights everywhere in the world. And so, they've really been able to confuse and mix up the distinction that there is between a citizen and non-citizen. And I think Tim, the way you described it is exactly what's happening and is showing up in public policy, not just in this area, but the downstream effects of that all the way through due process and citizenship, everything else. It's really apparent. 

Rick Green [00:24:56] Yeah, there's a great book, just a couple, I want to say like maybe three years ago by Victor Davis Hansen, a friend of everybody here on the program and just a phenomenal guy, he called it The Dying Citizen, How Progressive Elites, Tribalism and Globalization are Destroying the Idea of America. And his whole point is exactly what you guys just described. Basically, we've made being a citizen mean nothing. And so we've got to get back to what it means and the responsibilities that come with it, not just the rights that come with being a citizen, but the responsibilities that come with it as well. To your point, David, it's definitely happening in other states. I think if I read this right in the state of Washington, there's over 500 child care centers where Somali is the main language. I mean, are you kidding me? Come on. In fact, I saw numbers like they're 0.2% of the population, yet they're 10% of child care. I mean so the scam is not just in Minnesota. It's all over the country. 

David Barton [00:25:48] Yeah. And by the way, I mean, this question about democracy, et cetera, I would point people back to the book we have Stansberry's Catechism on the Constitution. It's an 1820s book that was done for students back then. And until we get our education system back in line, if you've got children, if you don't have children, if you're a citizen, if you're not a citizen. You need to know what the Constitution is all about. And so I would send you that that book at wallbuilders.com. Stansbury's Catechism on the Constitution. A reprint of an early textbook that we used in elementary school back then, but it's a great textbook for everybody today. 

Rick Green [00:26:25] Wallbuilders.com, and as we started off on the program today, just talking about the importance of being lifelong learners, always studying, trying to be a better citizen, trying to not only know what our rights are, but what those responsibilities are, and treating our neighbors the way we want to be treated. So that's what it means to be biblical citizen. Check it out today at wallbuilder.com. Thanks so much for listening to The WallBuilders Show.