Rick Green [00:00:07] Welcome to the intersection of faith and culture. It's the WallBuilder show taking on the hot topics of the day from a biblical, historical and constitutional perspective. Rick Green here with David Barton and Tim Barton. And we appreciate you joining us today. We sure encourage you to visit the websites wallbuilders.show for sharing the radio program with others, or for just catching up on programs you might have missed that's wallbuilders.show and then wallbuiulders.com is where you go for all of our other materials, catch up on all the conferences we have coming up this summer and into the fall. Also a great place to share links with your friends and family. There's some great swag in there, everything from hats and shirts to, to materials, all kinds of things that you can begin to celebrate the 250th even now, just get some of those, you know, those great themes about rebuilding and, and about the constitution. And I mean, start wearing clothes like that and get people to start asking you about it and let's spend the entire next year and couple of months, whatever we got left, actually talking about these things. Yesterday, Tim did a great primer on the... Declaration, and then even how all of those things led to clauses in the constitution. That's the kind of conversations we can have. You don't have to just listen to us on the radio, talk about it. You can be having conversations like that. So let's just make this a theme for the next 420 days or whatever we've got. And it's a, it's just a great opportunity to educate folks. So David and Tim, lots of, lots of opportunity to 50th coming up and, and of course we've got two 50th happening every few weeks. I think, the next one will be the next big one, I guess. So probably Bucker Hill. And, Dr. Joseph Warren, of course, killed it at bunker Hill and really neat guy. We ought to do a whole show on him at some point, probably would have been considered the greatest orator, even beyond Patrick Henry, had he not been killed at Bunker Hill, but, anyway, lots of cool opportunities coming up to learn that history. And, and, and actually, actually, let me ask you guys this. I know I should have already tossed to you, but y'all are doing a tour in the fall with,  with the Wildmans or I guess Tim you're doing, I don't know if David, if you're going on that one or not, but Tim, Tim Wildman, Walker Wildman. I think Stephen McDowell is going to be on that and y'all are going to hit the whole Boston thing and go see a lot of cool stuff. What is that? Like October something? 

Tim Barton [00:02:06] Yeah, there's actually two different trips and I think now I'm gonna have to look it up. I, for those that don't know, every week I'm on a plane going somewhere else. Often two or three planes. I'm going to look up Wildman Tours. And so I was going to say September and October. They both might be in October. We're doing one in the DC area. We're do one in a Boston area. Steve McDowell is one of our good friends. He's been on the program many times,  from Providence Foundation. And just incredible historian, kind of biblical foundation guy. A lot of what we've been doing for a lot of decades, he's been doing it, we, we've linked arms together many times. And so he and I are going to be the, the bussos,  we're going to be telling the stories as we drive around but I think dad, 

Rick Green [00:02:53] Now, wait, are you going to, are you going stand and keep your balance while the bus is making turns and talk on the microphone all at the same time? 

Tim Barton [00:03:01] Oh, that's no problem. I mean, for, you know, a kid that grew up riding horses, that is no problem! We definitley will

Rick Green [00:03:06]  October 12th, by the way, is, is the date for the Boston one. Octo that's the beginning of it. At wildmangroup.com is where you, where you can learn more. Now, I didn't realize you were doing the DC one as well. So they've got, they've gotten one in DC Williamsburg. So you'll be with them on the Washington DC one. And that one is, let's see here, September, September 17th, you're going to be there for Constitution day. Are you kidding me? How cool is that going to be? Yes. Love it. Love it, love it. I cut you off, man. You were talking about, you're going to be the, the,  bus guides, so you'll be talking as you're going and seeing all this cool stuff. 

Tim Barton [00:03:39] Yeah, we're just going to be able to tell the stories, much like we try to do in presentations, we are just going be actually on location. And so instead of saying, hundreds of years ago, this person was in this location, we'll say, actually see that building right there, that's the building where it actually happened, which is just so fun that one of the, the sad realities of the world we live in is that in many of the blue cities are some of the most significant historic landmarks. And so it's not always safe. It's not, always easy to get there to navigate around, but it really is amazing. I was in Philadelphia a couple of years ago and there's a really great museum of the American revolution there and genuinely, it is a really great museum of The American Revolution. And I was part of an event there and there was a huge protest outside the event. They broke the front glass they spray painted to face things. It was very sad. And so this is a sad reality. Now I'm giving that as a caveat because when you get to be on a bus, you're going to be in a much safer location where we're getting off of the tourist stops, getting back on. And so if, if you want to be able to go learn some of this history and not have to figure out where are we going to park, how are we going to drive around and navigate these areas and, and what hotels are we gonna stay in? It's all been figured out. You can just come and enjoy learning the story, seeing the locations, definitely something worth doing. And there are multiple of them. And so you can go to the website, find out more information about them, and sign up if it works. It's gonna be a lot of fun. 

Rick Green [00:05:14] Well, looking forward to lots of great opportunities this year, folks,  get in the mood to celebrate history and celebrate patriotism and restore patriotism, become what Ronald Reagan talked about informed citizens or informed Patriots, we're going to have a lot of, a lot of great chances to do that. And while doing that work hard to restore Liberty in our communities. And one of the,  12 step recovery plan items I've gotten in my book, rebuilding Liberty is restoring parental rights. And of course, parental rights includes knowing what in the world they're teaching your kids. At the local school. And of course we've had a lot of these battles over the years, guys, where the schools have tried to hide stuff from parents. They tried to prevent parents from being involved or even knowing what's being taught or the pronoun thing. I mean, just all kinds of stuff that has been hidden. Karen England is someone that's been, you know, at the tip of the spirit of that battle for, for decades and helping to fight that. Last week we had, or week before last, we had Bonnie Wallace on, talking about trying to clean up the libraries and get all that junk out of there. Karen's also in that fight and going to have some great resources to share today. So Karen Engel will be our special guest when we come back from the break. But this parental rights thing is, is hopefully coming to a head. I think people, they felt enough pain and enough people. They've seen enough of the craziness that they no longer dismiss us when we talk about how bad this stuff actually is. 

David Barton [00:06:27] You know, but I think there's more to it even than that, Rick. And as you mentioned, we've had some programs kind of on these general topics over the last few weeks and and it's like test, test, tests. Isn't that really bad that they have that kind of stuff in the library and that parents don't have rights and well, Have any kids or minor in school or I got home school or I got Christian school or whatever. Look, I go back to a really simple but I think a really profound passage that Jesus has in Matthew 18. And in Matthew 18, Jesus is talking and in verse six, he says, look, if anyone causes one of these little children to stumble, to stumble in their faith, their innocence, it's better for them to have a millstone around their neck and be drowned in the depths of the sea. Now, there's not many things in the Bible that Jesus really puts that kind of a weight literally around a mill stone around the neck. I mean, you can say the Bible, okay. Says are blasphemy in the Holy Spirit that's the unforgivable sin but this goes kind of up in that same weighty area that you do not violate the innocence and you do not take away the innocence of children that's just a really bad deal and this is one of those things that whether you have kids in school or not or whether you you protect your kids well at home that doesn't change the fact that there is no kid in America that needs their innocents violated. By the kind of stuff that's going on with schools, by the kinds of CRT nonsense, what's in the library stuff. This is one where every single citizen should get ticked, should get involved, and put their foot down and say okay, I am going to make sure we have school board members that do not put up with this nonsense. We're gonna protect the innocence of our kids. We're going to teach them how to read and write and not all this other sexualization that goes with it. Now I think this is one that we have to get over the thing of just hearing about these programs and isn't that bad. I'll protect my kids. You have to work at protecting every single kid out there because of the directive that Jesus gave. This is high on his priority list and he's behind our list as well. 

Rick Green [00:08:37] Yeah, it's important biblically. It's important for us in terms of just society itself. I mean, this is for posterity. This will have a big impact on the kind of world that we leave our children and our grandchildren. Karen England, our special guest when we return, we're gonna take a quick break. You're listening to The WallBuilders Show. 

Rick Green [00:09:58] Welcome back to the WallBuilder show. Karen England with us from Capital Resource Institute, fighting the good fight all over the country to protect our kids. Karen, hey, God bless you. Thanks for coming on. 

Karen England [00:10:08] Hey, thank you for having me. 

Rick Green [00:10:10] We know this is happening all over the country. In fact, had my friend, Bonnie Wallace on last week, talking about it got you this week talking about, we've got to raise awareness, people that think this is not happening in their own backyard, in their schools and their libraries. I don't think there's a community in the country where this is, is not happenin. So thanks for helping to lead the way and for equipping parents and, and other folks to, to be a part of it, uh before we even jump into The problem and the solution, the website that you want to give out today is at takebacktheclassroom.com 

Karen England [00:10:41] Yes, that's the website where you can look up your specific school district, the books with excerpts of the books that are in your public school library in all 50 states. 

Rick Green [00:10:54] Excellent. All right. Take back the classroom.com. So getting these tools in the hands of, of parents and activists across the country. Karen, let's get a little background first. What got you focused on this particular issue? I know you've been a, an activist for a while and, and, you know, homeschool drone kids and been a part of Eagle forum and concern women for America, which actually is where David Barton got started with wall builder. So, uh, definitely run it in the, in, in many of the same lanes, but, but this particular issue. Has taken on significant importance. What got you awakened to this one and decided to spend so much time and energy on it? 

Karen England [00:11:26] Well, yeah, you're right. I first got involved over 33 years ago over sex ed and how, you know, the terrible stuff that was in there. And to be honest, I used to poo-poo the moms that did the library books. I was like, who cares? It's a one-off. So what if there's a book in the library? And then when COVID hit, I started seeing what was in the libraries, What's a being asigned to the children to read. And I was just shocked at how starting in kindergarten, going all the way through their senior year, schools are using their libraries honestly to groom kids. And I would challenge anyone that doesn't agree with that statement or think it's hyperbole to go to our website where we have the books, we show the school they're in and we show excerpts from them. I'm not just crying wolf. This is a serious problem. With our tax dollars. We are supporting porn in schools with our tax dollars and porn in public libraries with our tax dollars, and not protecting minors from it. 

Rick Green [00:12:30] Yeah, that's exactly right. So it's not, it's, not just that the problem exists. It's the fact that we're funding it. We're, we're paying for it, which also means we have the ability to stop this. And there, and there are, you know, countless stories of, of victories with our friends, Jon and Machuku and others that are out there waking up parents and, and, school boards and putting the pressure on and, getting changes made, but you got to know where the problem is and what to do about it in order to actually fix the problem, you got to have the tools, you gotta know where to marshal the resources on this kind of thing. So that's why your website, I think is such a big help for people today. Uh, to be able to go in and actually find is their school. Well, we can just tell you, your school definitely has this problem, but then where to target it in that school. So what do you, what do it, what's kind of the one, two, three, I mean, what do you say to parents that might maybe their, their ears are open today and, and they're willing to, to engage what, how do you coach them on doing 

Karen England [00:13:18] Well, go to our website first and we've got a lot of information, step-by-step guide that explains the Pico case, which is the U.S. Supreme Court case that governs removal of library books from schools. It's very specific. And so really educate yourself and find out what is in your public school. And they are everywhere. And there are so many of them. And I was in that John Amanchukwu. And they shut him down from reading from one of the books because it was just too vulgar. Yet they have this vulgar book in their library. I mean, Bonnie Wallace is awesome. She's done some great things. I love her, I wanna be her when I grow up. So no, I love Bonnie, so committed to the cause. And she knows, she sees it, she gets it. Once you see it and you check out what, You can't deny it? And you're ready to go in and do something about it. 

Rick Green [00:14:22] Yeah, no doubt about it. And, and, you know, the, the thing that I think sometimes we hear about these things. And like you said, the first thing we often do is go, you know, is it really as big a problem as everybody says it is? And is it just one often? And then we realize, okay, yeah, it is a big problem, but is there anything I can do about it? Will it make a difference if I show up at my school board? Will it makes a difference? If I, if I put some time and effort into that, that's what do you say to the parents out there that they want to know it's, you can, you can actually get the results if you put in the effort. 

Karen England [00:14:49] Pinnography is in red states, blue states. No school district is safe. I know that they're working in Texas. I know my school district in Clarksville, Tennessee, red state, red county, has all sorts of pornographic books in their libraries. And it really is something, because of the way the Supreme Court ruled, that it does require our involvement to remove them. And your kids may be safe, you may be homeschooling, you may not need to go to the library, but what about all the other kids that are getting these terrible messages day in and day out starting in kindergarten? It desensitizes these kids. It tells them they were born in the wrong body, and it's not sex ed or puberty education, it's how. I don't want to say how to have sex and pleasure yourself and your partner. I mean, it's just very descriptive stuff. I am not, and it's not a one-off. 

Rick Green [00:15:45] And it's, and it's it's deviant stuff too. And it, and then it's being taught to, to, to little kids. And it just, it's just insane that, that we've gotten to this point, where it's even defended as part of what we talked about last week is it's defended by some of these school board members and, and quote unquote, community leaders who, who literally put a straight face on and actually defend having this kind of stuff in the library, absolutely amazing. 

Karen England [00:16:11] All you have to do is watch a school board meeting, or tonight I'm gonna be at the Huntington Beach, Huntington beach, California city council meeting where the city council did a great policy to remove the books out of the hands of minors. And the ACLU and American library association came and put a referendum on the ballot so that our kids can have access to all this porn. 

Rick Green [00:16:33] Man, it's a, I know people think we're exaggerating. I just know, I'm gonna get the emails, it's gonna be like, y'all, it is not that bad. And I don't know, do you think they're waking up? I mean, you've been fighting this a long time. 

Karen England [00:16:45] No, they, they are waking up, but we do have a messaging problem because the media wants to make it all about gay and lesbian and we just oppose a book because it has a lesbian character. No, I oppose that book because its graphic sexual scenes that they have pictures of. Whether they're gay or straight, I would object that book. And so it doesn't belong in the hands of minors. And we're all complicit if we know this is happening and we're still letting our dollars go for it. And anyone that thinks that I'm exaggerating or you're exaggerating, they need to go to our website, takebacktheclassroom.com. At the top, there's an orange button that lists all the books. And you can look at the book and you can at all the, you know, several excerpts from the book. And you decide if this is appropriate for minors. 

Rick Green [00:17:32] Right. Right. Yeah. And I think that's the thing that, I mean, I've seen pastors, you know, look at some of these pages and just in shock go, man, okay, now I believe now I understand how, how bad it is. And sometimes you've got to do that. It's like the old William Wilberforce thing in the movie, Amazing Grace, you know where he steers the tour guide boat over to the slave ship and they smell this, the stench of death and disease. And all of a sudden it wakes them up. And in the same way here, sometimes you just gotta put the graphic stuff in front of people to make them realize how bad. 

Karen England [00:17:58] I do, and I will say I usually end all of my public talks with the Wilburforce quote about you're complicit if you can't unsee what you've seen. And so I encourage people to really take a look at it. It is pervasively vulgar and our kids are being introduced to it all the time. And most of the time, like we can look these books up, they're checked out. 

Rick Green [00:18:25] Well, it's not like they're just sitting on the shelf. It's influence in a generation. And I mean, look at the results. I mean you see the, you know, just the numbers and the data and the ages of these kids that are getting into this stuff. And it's just, it, it it's shocking. So listen, this is something you said that I think we should close on is, you know, sometimes. Sometimes we want to think, okay, well, yeah, I know that's happening in the public school, but I'm not having to worry about it over here. Listen, those kids in the public school are going to be your neighbors. They're going to your leaders. They're gonna be your business owners. You're going be your fellow voters. We cannot just ignore the 80% of the children that are in these schools. And I love the fact that you said that. And it's like, no, even if your kids are homeschooled or private school or whatever, we need to care enough about our communities to engage in this. 

Karen England [00:19:09] Well, and I agree that, and the church needs to, you know, we volunteer at good news clubs, we do all sorts of inner city stuff, homeless ministries, all of this. Who's advocating for those kids that are already getting bad messages or there's a father not in the home? We don't need to be paying for more bad messages to these kids. And if we aren't going to stand in the gap as Christians for them, who is going to do that. 

Rick Green [00:19:35] Absolutely, Karen, God bless you for what you're doing. Let's let's give the website out again. Take that way to make sure I say it right. Takebacktheclassroom.com. Takebackclassroom.com

Karen England [00:19:45] Yep, thank you for having me. 

Rick Green [00:19:47] Of course, Karen England, thanks for coming on. Stay with us, folks. We'll be right back with David and Tim Barton. 

Rick Green [00:20:58] Welcome back to the WallBuilders show. Thanks for staying with us. Thanks to Karen England for being with us as well. Encourage folks to get involved. Again, this is one of those 12 step items, uh, for the next year and month or so to be involved with on the two 50th is parental rights and, and fighting that battle at the local level, in the schools, in the libraries, David, you were saying before, um, the interview, how important it is for even if your kids not going to that school, we, we might be able to say, Hey, listen, I'm homeschooling or I'm private schooling or my kids are grown or whatever, I don't have a dog in that Yes, you do, because those kids that are in those schools are going to be the ones voting, running the businesses, you know, be all of that. And they're going to your neighbors. They're going be influencing the culture. So we've got a stake in influencing what's happening at the local school. 

David Barton [00:21:39] Well, you have a state, but y'all have also have a responsibility. Proverbs 28, 27 talks about if you see a need and you turn away your eyes, you'll be judged if you say, man, that's terrible. It's going to that public school, but I'm looking at my kids and my kids. You're OK. No, no, no. You can't see a knee and turn away. Your eyes. This is one of the things that really requires involvement. And if if those of us who knew what's right became intolerant of this and got really upset over it. This wouldn't last long in the country because they're, you know, this is one of the issues that Trump got on the gender stuff. And it's an 80 20 issue in the nation. And that shocked Democrats that it was an 80, 20 issue. This is one that everybody's on our side, except the radicals that are out there. And so if those that are on that 80% side would do something about this, this would be a dinosaur that's extinct. I mean, this would go away, but you also have Ezekiel three. And it says, look, if you see someone. That's about to get in trouble and you don't reach out and warn them. The Bible says, I'll require his blood at your hands. If he gets lost because of what happens and you didn't do anything to stop that or warn it, I'm gonna require it from you. It's not just that he did something wrong, I'm going to require it form you because you didn' do anything to try to stop it. And so this, you know, I don't talk like this very often, but this is one of those issues that I think biblically really rises to the level of something that is genuinely his heart. There's very few things where he says you might as well hang only one thing he says hang a millstone around your neck but very few things to that kind of weighty consequence and so this is one that everybody needs to get involved with and we need to get this stuff stopped all over the nation as quick as we can. 

Tim Barton [00:23:21] Well, and dad, as you mentioned, something that everybody should get involved with. It's, it really is connected. We make this point often with the American government that we, the people is how the constitution starts. Who, who's in charge of America? It's not the president. It's. Not Congress. It's the Supreme court. We, the people are the ones who are ultimately in charge. And so if our nation is going the wrong direction, we're the ones responsible. We, we are the one's ultimately accountable. And for those that would say, well, it's not me because I didn't support any of that. But if you're not getting involved, then this is where we can back up to Bill Federer, we had on the program a month or two ago now, I don't remember when it was. But he had a book out called, Silence is Consent, and was giving actually some history on the background of even the Old Testament. Where if a daughter made a vow, the father was the one that had the right one. He heard that vow, he could say, we're not doing that. And he could break the vow. Now the daughter made the vow, she couldn't break it, but the father could break that vow. Which is why in weddings, it used to be that the minister would ask the question, does anyone see any reason why these two should not be wed? Let them speak now or forever hold this peace. And if the father was silent, silence equaled consent. When we are not involved in the process, our un-involvement is ultimately giving a level of consent to what this is. And dad, even to make the connection from the biblical, as you pointed out very well, this is the only thing in the Bible when it comes to dealing with kids that Jesus said, you know what, it's better for you just to go kill yourself, like have a millstone tied around your neck, thrown into the sea, that's better for you. It's interesting of all the things that Jesus dealt with. When the woman that was caught in adultery was brought to him and he says, woman, right? Where are your accusers after he's already nailed down or written in the sand and the oldest to youngest one by one, the Pharisees, they finally all leave realizing, hey, this guy's outsmarted us, it's not going to work. Cause he said, let him who has no sin cast the first stone, but you can go through all of those ideas of scripture of where Jesus encountered people in sin or dealt with the Pharisee and there were times he called the Pharisee's names. But he never told the Pharisees, even when he said, right? You're like these dead men's bones, empty tombs, white wash sepulchers, like all the things he called them, never once did he say, you might as well tie a millstone around your neck and go throw yourself in the ocean. The only time something was that significant was when it dealt with children. And we have an issue that is that significant in our culture. And if we don't get involved, silence can equal our consent. And this goes back to. I think, guys, was it, I don't remember, was it Bonhoeffer or Neemuller who said, silence in the face of evil is itself evil. That's the reality of what this is right now. If we are silent, we are giving consent. 

Rick Green [00:26:14] Well, so thankful for Karen England, Bonnie Wallace, John Amachukwu. I mean, all of these people out there that have helped awaken the nation. They have brought attention to this sometimes very, uh, necessarily bluntly. It's kind of like the, you know, amazing grace movie where, we're William Overhorse moves the ship over to the little tour guide, boat over to slave ship and the stench and the, and the disease wakes them up. And in many ways, that's what's been necessary in this case. So thanks to Karen England today for joining us. Thank you for listening. You've been listening to the WallBuilders Show.