Rick Green [00:00:07] Welcome to the Warbler Show. We are picking up where we left off yesterday with David Barton speaking at the Pro-family Legislators conference on the Bible in schools. I'm Rick Green, America's Constitution coach. David Barton, of course, America's premier historian and our founder at WallBuilders, and Tim Barton, national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. All three of us appreciate you listening to The WallBuilders Show. Encourage you to go listen at WallBuilders Dot show because that's where you can pick up on any programs you've missed over the last few weeks, especially if you missed last Thursday and Friday. That was David Barton's presentation on what we do when a prayer has been answered as big as this one with the election and how throughout history in America we press the gas. When he answers that prayer, we go gain ground. And that's what we've got to do right now. Today, we're picking up on what David started yesterday with us in his presentation on the Bible in school. So you want to check that out at the website WallBuilders.Show. But for now, we're just going to jump in right where we left off yesterday with David Barton at the Pro-family Legislators conference. 

David Barton [00:01:05] Thomas Jefferson under George Washington was a secretary of state who laid out the city of Washington, D.C. when he became president. 1801. He's the first president to have his entire presidency in D.C.. John Adams had his last three months of his presidency in D.C. Before that, we were in New York and Philadelphia. So Jefferson is the first one to live in the White House for a full term. And as president of the United States, that also makes him in charge of Washington, D.C. Now, he had the government Affairs Committee in the Congress that runs D.C. but D.C. is not allowed to be a state. It has to be as a separate entity belonging to the federal government. It can't be in a state. So statehood for D.C. is not going to happen. It's not going to work. Constitution forbids it. So what happens is Thomas Jefferson was made, the president of the school board in Washington, D.C. Thomas Jefferson is the guy who created the plan of public education for Washington, D.C. public schools because Washington is under the jurisdiction of the federal government. So he's the guy who partially created that plan. And it's interesting to see the first years report. The superintendent of public education, Washington, D.C., using Jefferson's plan is now given the report for here's what's happened in the first year of schools. He says 55 have learned to read in the Old and New Testaments and are now able to spell words of three, four and five syllables, he said. Of the 59, they did not know a single letter. 20 can now read the Bible and spell words of three, four and five. So the Bible being used to teach reading, Bible being used to teach spelling. Yes. And this is Thomas Jefferson's plan. And we're told he's the guy who gave a separation of church and state, and we have no clue of our own history. And this is what's significant about things like this going to 1816. I want to show you the superintendent of public education, New Jersey, in 1816. This is an annual report. And I have these from states all over the United States. But here's New Jersey, 1816, superintendent of public instruction. He's talking about first and second grade. He calls a first or second classes. He said all the scholars of the first and second classes commit to memory portions of the New Testament, Psalms, a lesson of the catechism, several hymns and the text of the preceding Sabbath. So everybody in first or second grade, this is what they're memorized and they're memorized and just Muslim slices. And that was the text that preceded the Sabbath. Whatever a preacher talked about on Sunday, we're going to memorize every verse he mentioned on Sunday. So whatever that text was, that's what memorize it. Now, he said that in this first and second grade group, there's always smarter kids and others. We always know that, he said. One of the scholars is committed to memory the Book of John and the first three Psalms together of 119. So I will not ask any of you, you're a smart as a second grader New Jersey in 1816 but memorized and Psalm 119 memorized in the gospel John and 30 Psalm pretty impressive. But of course, he's a special kid. Not everybody does that. As the superintendent pointed out, he said the majority have committed remember the gospel. But John, all of our second graders memorize the gospel of John. But we had one kid who memorized some one not really all the second graders memorize the gospel New Jersey public schools. And then let's go to 1828. This is what Noah Webster comes out with his famous dictionary, this two volume set right here. It's bigger than I'm going to hold up because I got a hand that's got a mike in it. But that two volume set the dictionary. First time he defines 70,000 words in America that a never before had been defined. We kind of knew what they were. But now we have the definition. And as you go through and look at all things, it's called the school massacre to America. He started he wrote so many public school textbooks. But just going back to his dictionary, you have this in every classroom to look up words. And when you look at words, I want you to see here the word chief. If you could see right in the middle there, the word chief, see all the definitions that he has. I want you to see the examples he has. For example, up top. You see, that's the first definition down here. It gives a definition. And notice that he quotes from First Chronicles 11. That's where he points to to show the use of that word. If you use the next word, you see the second one. He's there. Quotes from Numbers Chapter three Job Chapter 29 and Matthew chapter 20. If you look at the next definition down there at the bottom, he's quoting from Deuteronomy 115 and from First Kings chapter nine. And the very bottom definition, he says, is quoting first verse Samuel 15, and from Psalms 68, etc. 23% of all the definitions in his dictionary use Bible verses to show you how that word was used. This is the public school dictionary that we have at every classroom is Webster's 1828 Dictionary. So he's he's one of the top three educators in American history for public education. 

Rick Green [00:05:33] Alright  first quick break. We'll be right back. You're listening to The WallBuilders Show. 

Rick Green [00:06:44] Welcome back to the WallBuilders Show. But our show jumping right back in with David Barton, speaking at the Pro-family legislators conference on the Bible in schools. 

David Barton [00:06:51] No Webster in this textbook here. This is the history right here. This is the history of the United States, this textbook that Webster did for our schools. No, Webster said this. He said, all the miseries enables, which means suffer from vice crime, ambition, injustice, oppression, slavery and more. All of these evils proceed from despising, neglecting the precepts contained in the Bible. Now, this is again what we're teaching students in public schools. If you go to 1844, there was a case that reached the U.S. Supreme Court. That case was called Vidal versus Gerard's Executors. It was argued by Daniel Webster in this three day case that went to the Supreme Court. You had a school in Philadelphia that said, you know, we don't think we're going to let ministers on the campus anymore. And Webster said, do not let ministers on campus. That means you're not going to have the Bible in classrooms anymore. And so he argued for three days that you can't have a school that won't let the Bible be in the schools. And so the U.S. Supreme Court, in a nine or an eight zero decision unanimously said that if it's a government funded school, you will teach the Bible, we're not going to have a government funded school that won't use the Bible. Now, that's unanimous Supreme Court decision. I don't think anybody hears about that in law school anymore. They only see what happened after 1962, 63. But the decision was written by Joseph Story is called The Father of American Jurisprudence in the Supreme Court's decision. This is what he said in the majority decision, he said, Why may not the Bible, especially the New Testament, be read or taught as a divine revelation in the schools, not a history book as divine revelation in the schools? Is it work in the purest principles of morality be learned so clearly or so perfectly as from the New Testament. So this is that this is a Supreme Court justice is put on the court. But James Madison was there 33 years is called the father of American jurisprudence. There's no question of his credentials. And he said, guys, we're not going to have a public school in America. This government funded this, not going to teach the Bible. And we're going to teach the Bible is divine revelation, not as a history book. So, again, this is history. This a tradition. The court said if you can show there's a long standing history tradition, then it's got to be constitutional. Moved out. 1849 I'll take to Zachary Taylor. President Taylor, just notice the rhetoric of the president on on education. He says the Bible is the best of books. I wish it were. The hands of everyone is indispensable to the safety and permanence of our institutions, not our faith, but our institutions, he said. Especially should the Bible be placed in the hands of the young. It is the best school book in the world. I would that all of our people were brought up under the influence that holy book. So here's the president saying, Hey, we all know the Bible is the best school book in the world, and that's what makes America special, makes us different. If you go to 1876, you have Ulysses S Grant. This is the 100th anniversary of America in 1876. So what you see here is the message of President Grant. You see the message, President Grant and up top it says Centennial. And then you see the 1876, 1776, 1876, President Grant came out with this card and you can see that it says to the children and youth of the United States. So the president has a message for young people. What is the message, What you said below? And this is what he said. He said, hold fast to the Bible as a sheet anchor of your liberties, right precepts in your heart and practice them in your lives to the influence of this book, where adapted for all the progress made in true civilization. And to this we must look as our God in the future righteousness exalts. A nation sends a reproach. Any people? What do you think happens? Death. Any modern president does that card for public school students and this is this is typical. This is what we had been doing for generations and generations and generations. This is how little we know our own history today. We think this stuff is unusual. No, this is this is mainstream. Your 1892. I have two examples here I want to show you with the superintendent of public education in Pennsylvania School said in 1892 he's laying out what the curriculum is going to do and what every teacher needs to be doing in the classrooms. He says he's talking about memorization. He said lots of selections, memorize selections, lots of selections for the week, be it possible to a number, the first from the Bible or Sacred song and the second from the world of literature, prose or verse. Say, for example, have the kids memorize. And one week the 90th Psalm and Lincoln's speech at Gettysburg or maybe lead Connelly Line and Longfellow's Almanac because we're doing two a week or memorize the 23rd Psalm and lost once to every man or nation or the 19th Psalm and Home Sweet Home or My Country Tis of Thee in the Chamber Nautilus or the 13th chapter Corinthians in the last row of summer, or any of the others of hundreds of good things moral, religious, patriotic descriptors, sentimental, and the best sense of the word that we should all be very glad to have securely lodged in the memory. So public schools Pennsylvania. Every week we're going to memorize a chapter, the Bible and some piece of literature. So we're going to memorize two things. Are we imagine today if we had that as a standard for kids in school. I mean, we know we don't even memorize three lines out of a poem without a lot of grief. And by the way, notice what the superintend put at the end there, he says. And by the way, let the teacher always commit to memory. What? Is here required of the pupil. So teachers have to memorize this stuff to not just tell the kids to do it. 1892 Also there. 1892 is the 400th anniversary of Columbus lying to the world. They had a big world fair in Chicago. And at that point time, a man named H. And Gaines is a superintendent of public instruction. He wrote a book on the four centuries of education in America from the time of Columbus. And he's talking about education. And this is what he says in the book. And by the way, here's that book from 1892. This is the 1892 book that he did, The History of Columbian Education in America. And in that book, he says now the free public schools of America are the outgrowth of the pastoral schools of New England. That was the New England primer. The other stuff. It was the church who started the schools, and that was public education. And we did that to make it make sure everybody knew the Bible. He said The free public schools of America with our gross or partial schools of New England. He said, nurtured in the lap of the church. These schools soon became so necessary to society at large that the church reluctantly relinquished your claims on this school. So all schools used to belong to the church. 

Rick Green [00:12:55] Now the break. Everybody, stay with us. We'll be right back. You're listening to The WallBuilders Show

Rick Green [00:14:06] Welcome back to the WallBuilders Show. But a show jumping right back in with David Barton speaking at the Pro-family legislators conference on Bible in schools in Massachusetts. 

David Barton [00:14:14] They said, you know, education is so important, let the state get involved in education as well. So now education has moved from the church to the state. And he says now whether this is wise or not is not my purpose. I'm not going to talk about whether the church should have let the state get involved in education. So that's not my purpose here. He said. The only thing I want to say, he said, I'm not going to say I'm not going to discuss this further than to remark that he gives three conditions. He said, the only thing I'm going to say is that, number one, if the study of the Bible is to be excluded from all state schools, if we ever get to the point where we don't study the Bible, schools are number two. If we get to the point where the inculcation of the principles of Christianity is to have no place in the daily program of public schools, state run education, he said. Or if, number three, the worship of God is to form no part of the general exercise of these public, he said. If we ever get to the point where in education we don't we don't worship God, we don't teach the scriptures and we don't read. The Bible said if we ever get to that point, he said, the good of the state would be better served by restoring all schools of church control. If we ever get the secular education America, get out of the education business, give it back to the church. Now, this is the superintendent of public education, the 400. So look how far America has gone in a relatively short period of time. This is where we were in 1892. And so this is what was in that textbook in 1947. Final thing I'll show you here as we start wrapping this up. 1947, these textbooks right here. Now, you see on the front, it says Bible study course, Old Testament, Dallas High Schools. Here's the New Testament. Courses were courses were credit. In Dallas 1947, there were used until 1974. Nearly every major city had these textbooks. We found these in Indianapolis and Cincinnati and St Louis. Nearly every major school had these textbooks. And this is a course, Old Testament, New Testament and public schools up through 1974. And there's memorization to be done with every lesson. And here you see the memorization here, memorize the existence of Christ. And beginning was the word. The words are with God. The word was God. All things were made by him, and without him wasn't anything made that was made. And the words made flesh and dwelt among us. And we beheld his glory, the glories. It was the only begotten Father, full of grace and truth. As public schools across America. Up through 1974. And then there are questions on every lesson it says you see here, read about the priests as Christ. Where was Christ before he was born on Earth? What titles is John apply to Christ in this chapter? For what purpose was John sent by God? May I suggest that this is not even been done in most Bible schools today? And this is public education in America up through the 70s. They're not zation birth of emphasis of Jesus. They name five things the angel told Mary concerning her child. Jesus watches were Jesus mean. How did the angel explain this is proper schools? What happened in 1962? Things changed in 1962 in a case called called Eagle versus Vital June of 1962, the court said, you know, we've had prayer in school since the very beginning, but we're progressives and we always progressed past things. We always do anew. And it's time to do something new in America. And that's the that's it. The old progressives, they never look at history. They never see what works or not. It's always just time to do something new. So they're always progressing. Woodrow Wilson started this nonsense. It's evolution and society is time to evolve society. So they did that. And within 12 months they had two more decisions. The average miracle that and they said, and by the way, we're not doing Bible schools in. We're now significant. This is where it all changed these three cases in 12 months, less than 12 months. And the court says and the decision the court says this is without historical or legal precedent. Never before have we taken the Bible out of schools. There's no historical or legal precedent. But this is what we're doing in America starting right now. And so that's what they now say, and that's where everything is. And people think our history is what it's been since 1962, 63. Not at all. They admitted that there was no precedent for what they did. And when they took the Bible out of schools, what reason did they give they cortisol? They quoted psychologist Solomon Grizzle and they said a portion of the New Testament were read with that explanation that could been had been psychologically harmful to the child. Really, you determine the Bible causes brain damage. And that's why you you guys or psychologist. No, but see this is this again, read the court's own decisions. So what happened was the First Amendment went out the door. No longer do we care about the First Amendment. And they had so many cases now come to the court seeking to remove every religious expression and get rid nativity scenes, get rid of graduation, get rid of backyards, get rid of creation science in schools. And so the court in 1971 took a case called Limit versus Kurtzman. They said, let us just give you a test. We'll give you a three pronged test. And this will tell you whether something is constitutional or not. It's called the lemon test. Based on that that case named Lemon versus Kurtzman. And the number one way to tell if something's constitutional, they said the best way to know if a religious activities constitutional is to determine whether it's primarily secular. You cannot name a single religious activity that is primarily secular, which is why we lost 7300 cases after that decision came out. Everything that has religion in public has gone out the door because the limited test, because it's impossible to show any religious activity, is primarily secular. Now, what happened was the core started changing. This is not the policy we have today. A change has come. Five years ago, we had justices put on the Supreme Court that actually started reading the Constitution, the United States. And when it did, that's where we started getting in decisions like that blatant brute cross case that I started with where the court said, hey, you know, if we were using Lemon test and this would have to take that court down. But the court said we don't think the limited test applies to this. And that's where they said historical practices we take. Lemon is not a good test for this. And so the quote I gave you earlier, they said this. This is the longstanding practice as we want. 

Rick Green [00:19:59] Alright folks last break of the day. Stay with me. We'll be right back. You're listening to The WallBuilders Show. 

Rick Green [00:22:09] Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on the WallBuilders Show. But a show jumping right back in now for the conclusion of David Barton's presentation at the Pro-family Legislators conference, speaking on the Bible in schools. 

David Barton [00:22:21] The 2022 and Boston City Hall. Boston, They said we will. They fly a third flagpole where citizens can fly whatever flag they want. They flew, I think, 217 different flags. Camp constitution came as said. We have a Christian flag, a camp constitution, fly it. Boston said there is no way we're flying a Christian flag. It went to the Supreme Court and at the Supreme Court. This is the decision. Shurtleff versus city of Boston at the Supreme Court, the court said, you know, if we use the Lemon decision, we would tell you, don't fly that flag. But Justice Breyer, who I consider to be the most secular justice on the US Supreme Court, certainly one of the most liberal, he said, you know, we did that lemon decision back in the bygone era when the court took a more freewheeling approach to interpreting the legal text. We didn't care about law or history back then, he said, We're not there anymore. Did you know that case, that court and A90 unanimous decision told Boston it has to fly the Christian flag? Now, that's a real turnaround because even your liberals are saying you got to fly the flag. This this is complete turnaround. The courts changed that much, even the liberals on the court. And then, of course, as a coach Kennedy case and you hear from Coach Kennedy in a little bit, but Coach Kennedy and that decision that that Bremerton versus Kennedy decision, that's where the court said, you know, if we had to use lemon test here, we would tell you that you can't have this prayer at football. Coach can't pray. But this is where the court said we're now vacating the Lemon decision is now bad law. We're taking it out. And this is this is where 7300 cases go out the door. So the test right now, good one to use is this of long standing, religious expressive practices require a strong presumption. If you can show historically that this has been done for a good while, you're going, you have a really good chance of prevailing in the courts. And that's where the Bible in schools is. So what Ron Walters is doing in Oklahoma, what others are starting started do what what happened with with the governor in Louisiana signed the Ten Commandments bill. We have the Ten Commandments bill coming up. And Texas hero Bill King is running that. This is this is the deal you've got to be able to show. It's a long standing religious practice tradition. If so, you'll go through the court and you want to work on having a good attorney general. And if you don't, then put a provision in the bill that lets an outside group come in and defend it. That's been done with the lots defending freedom and first liberty and others. If you don't trust your attorney general, put a provision in there, go with an outside group, come in and be able to pick up the state and defend the legislature, but start challenging this. This is a way of moving forward. 

Rick Green [00:24:54] Alright everybody we are out of time for today. That was David Barton speaking at the Pro-family Legislators Conference on the Bible. In schools, you can get the entire presentation which we aired yesterday here on the WallBuilders Show and then today. So you get the whole thing at our website. WallBuilders Dot Show, that's WallBuilders Dot show. If you want go to wallbuilders.com that's our main website. That's where you can get all kinds of resources for yourself and your family. That's also where you can make that one time or monthly contribution that fuel in the tank man you want to help take ground back. You want to help get Bibles in schools. You want to help get good legislators elected and and people trained to run for office and pastors trained on the founding of our country. And all of those things make a donation today at WallBuilders dot.com that's wallbuilders.com And then last thing I'll say, I mentioned it yesterday and I'm going to go as much into detail today but be sure you visit Patriot academy.com as well. If you would like to come through the Patriot experience. That's everything we offer at Patriot Academy. So that's the Constitution train. You get a full constitution crash course. It's the legislative simulation. You will be a legislator for a few days in our legislative chamber right there at the Patriot Academy campus in Fredericksburg. It's the public speaking workshop. It's the life purpose training. It's how to speak in committees are in at hearings for your local government offices. And then if you want to add on a constitutional defense course, you can get your handgun defense class where you will learn to defend yourself and your family and get that really good Second Amendment intellectual ammunition as well. All of that. The entire Patriot experience happening in December at the Fredericksburg campus. And we've got a few slots left, but they are going fast. So be sure and sign up today at Patriot academy.com. Click on the button for the Patriot Experience. All right, folks, thanks so much for listening. You've been listening to The WallBuilders Show.