Rick Green

Welcome to the Intersection of Faith and Culture. It's the WallBuilders Show. We're taking on the hot topics of the day from a biblical, historical and constitutional perspective. If you've missed any programs recently, shame on you. No, I'm kidding, but you did miss out. Make sure you go to wallbuilders.show. Catch some of those previous interviews, or some Good News Fridays, some Foundations of Freedom, thursday . that's the radio site. And then also go to wallbuilders.com. That's our main site and that's where you can get all kinds of great tools and resources and very important you can contribute to the cause. So make your donation there. That will help us reach more people, train more pastors, train more legislators, young leaders all the different things we're doing to restore this constitutional republic. You can come alongside us, lock shields with us by making that donation, put some fuel in the tank and let's go save this nation. Wallbuilders.com I'm here with the founder of WallBuilders, David Barton.

He's America's premier historian and Tim Barton, national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. And I'm Rick Green, America’s constitution coach. David and Tim man we got a lot of work to do, but it's not just in the election. You know we had Steve Dason talking about the election. It's the lawfare and all the legal battles. David, you're the one that pointed out to me years ago the scripture in Isaiah 1:26, lawyers at the beginning, judges at the first, then you'll be a righteous city. So fighting on this legal front and getting back to the place of good biblical justice is just as important as the elections, in my opinion. I don't know. What do you guys think?

David Barton

Well, that goes back to what you just mentioned about yesterday with the voting numbers we looked at, because where do you get judges? It comes from presidential appointments. These are federal cases. We're talking federal appointees that's chosen by a president of the United States. So what you're going to have is you're going to have either Donald Trump choosing federal judges for the next four years or Kamala Harris. We know what Donald Trump is going to give us because he gave us that for four years. We know the 200 judges he gave us and we have seen the government turn around in major areas we've all been wishing for.

The fourth branch is decreasing in size. The federal courts are taking power away from it. Religious liberty is coming back. There are so many areas that are moving in the right direction coming back. There are so many areas that are moving in the right direction. And the election we were just talking about yesterday it looks like 41, 42, 43 percent of active church-going people are saying I'm not going to vote. Just back to the verse you just quoted, rick, Isaiah 1:26, that if you get judges, the right kind of judges, you can be a righteous land and a righteous place and you're not going to get those kind of justice from Kamala and that's just real clear and you can see that by the record when she was US Senator, of the type of judges she supported and what she did and the question of those judges. So this is a huge issue.

Tim Barton

Well, you know, guys, even the fact that President Biden appointed a Supreme Court justice who could not define, or chose not to define, what a woman was.

This is the level of the woke ideology that is out there, and we have seen not the least of scenarios, whether it be some of the immigration issues where illegal immigrants have done in some cases, some of these terrorists that have come across the southern border that have done these heinous things that have been released, because, whether it's a district attorney not wanting to pursue this, police officers with orders to let them go, or a judge, in some cases, who decided that you can't, you can't prosecute this individual, given whatever status, this is the legal system that we are seeing, and we are are seeing it weaponized against basic law and order, this notion of the constitutional republic we live in, where justice is supposed to be blind.

You have a very clear standard of justice upheld that is all being done away with because we no longer have leaders that promote the notion that justice is blind. We have a president right now and his team, his administration, his vice president, that are absolutely in favor of targeting their political opponents. Unfortunately, and that's actually part of what today's show is about is going through and breaking down a little bit some more of what's happened with people that have tried to stand up for truth, that have tried to stand up for what the laws actually say, and they were penalized for trying to do the right thing.

David Barton

Yeah, and the problem with that is and, tim, as you just mentioned at the program today, there's a whistleblower law so that people can feel free to come forward and show when law is being violated, because laws are passed.

We live by the rule of law.

We're a nation of laws, we have a constitutional republic. Laws are important, and so whistleblower laws are to protect the people who say wait a minute. The government itself or officials themselves are violating the laws that are passed and they've got to live up to the same standards that people do. And so in this case today, what you've got is a whistleblower pointing out officials violating very clear laws and, instead of being rewarded for helping uphold the law, now they're going after the whistleblower because they've decided that the thing they're blowing the whistle on is something that people like and the administration chooses not to uphold those laws. So this is a problem in several areas. When you refuse to uphold the laws, as an administration, you pick and choose the laws you want to uphold, and when you go after the people the laws are supposed to protect, you've got everything exactly backwards, and so we've got.

Rick Green

 We recently interviewed the lady who was part of this whistleblower scenario. Now we've got the attorney on and it's a very revealing thing that's happening right now with the current climate in the country.

Yeah, I think folks get ready for this interview. Hopefully it upsets you to again here. We heard from the nurse in this case, and just to know that the good guys actually blowing the whistle on the evil that's happening, they're the ones that our government goes after and we've got to turn this around. So stay with us, we'll be right back. We're going to take a quick break. You're listening to the Wall Builder Show.

Tim Barton

Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on the WallBuilders Show. Marcella Burke is with us. Attorney out of Houston, Texas, served in the Trump administration over at the Department of Interior and at the EPA, and she's representing two amazing clients who are up against the machine right now for simply standing up for the law and for some good ethics. So, Marcella, thank you so much for coming on today.

Marcella Burke

Thanks for having me.

Rick Green

Well, we had one of your clients, Vanessa, on a few days ago or a week ago, I can't remember when it was, and got some of the story of what happened there at the hospital. Unfortunately, this is going on all over the country, but then maybe this case can lead the way to put a stop to this nonsense. But tell us what you can about the case itself. Why are they coming after your clients as whistleblowers who simply pointed out what was actually happening? They're not actually even denying, I guess, what they were doing, but yet they're bringing down the weight of the government on your clients.

Marcella Burke

Right. So the government has done something that's very extraordinary here. Typically, when there's a whistleblower, it's Department of Justice policy that you don't prosecute whistleblowers. There's actually statutory protections for whistleblowers in order to encourage people to come out when they see laws being violated at their corporations.

Hospital who didn't know each other, who both blew the whistle that there were illegal, potentially illegal, surgeries and procedures on minors by the transgender clinic at the hospital, the attorney general in 2022 put out an opinion in Texas saying that these procedures are illegal and the hospital announced that it wasn't doing these procedures within a month, and it was about a year later, in 2023, that Christopher Rufo published a couple of stories with Dr Haim and Vanessa Sivadge, who you interviewed, who both blew the whistle separately, anonymously that this was still actually happening at the hospital and there was a law being passed in Texas that especially Dr Haim wanted to be sure got passed, and so part of his whistleblowing was to help get that law in fact passed.

And it did get passed, and it was within a month that the Department of Justice sent Dr Haim a target letter, visited him at his home and said he was going to be the subject of an investigation involving this transgender program, not the hospital, and we, of course, didn't understand at all. It was later that Vanessa came out and said well, no, you know, this is happening. You know, don't indict Dr Haim. And the FBI then visits Vanessa at her home, and so it's just a really mind-boggling case for a lawyer. There's a couple partners at our firm and we've got lawyers from three firms that are former Department of Justice attorneys, including the former US attorney in the Southern District of Texas, which is the district where this case is being brought, who've never seen anything like it. So, yes, the government is coming after the whistleblowers and it doesn't look like they're at all investigating the hospitals.

Rick Green

So let me make sure I got this right. In my simple mind, we have child abuse happening essentially and Texas law would back me up on that and a hospital lying about whether or not they're participating in this, and so some good guys and gals step forward and say, hey, this is wrong, this is happening and, as you said, the law protects whistleblowers for doing exactly that.

Because we want to encourage people to shine the light on bad things that are happening and, instead of going after the bad actors that are doing the child abuse and doing these terrible things to kids, we go after the people that said that, that pointed at them. I mean, this would be like going after the people that turn in a drug dealer or turn in a murderer or turn in anybody that's committing a crime. It's the person that says, oh yeah, I saw the crime, here's what happened, and we're we're going to spend our time and energy going after them and then, to top it all off off, the intimidation and the chilling effect of having I guess the fbi were the ones that showed up at the at their homes. Um, you know, for you know this, this uh, uh, turning, turning it all on on them instead of on the, on the bad actors. Have I got that right?

Marcella Burke

yeah wow yep

Rick Green

 wow, this is this is this. You know we're both attorneys. I love the law, I love the Constitution, I love the rule of law. I grieve when I see abuse of justice and and see the legal system used in this kind of way. You've been in DC, You've you've been inside the belly of the beast and you know I only did that at the state level. How do you respond to this? I mean, obviously you're taking the case so you care about it and you and you want to stop this kind of nonsense. But this is not an isolated incident. How do you, how do you assess the state of our justice system in America when this kind of thing can happen?

Marcella Burke

Well, that's a great question. It's it's. It's really remarkable as an attorney. Like I said before, we've taken it very seriously as attorneys and we initially wrote a letter actually to Congress, to the Task Force on the Weaponization of the Department of Justice, and that was written to Jim Jordan, the chairman of the subcommittee on the weaponization of the federal government, and to Chip Roy, the chairman of the subcommittee on Constitution and Limited Government. So in 2024, we were just very concerned about what the DOJ was doing, and so in this letter which is, you know, subject to our law licenses and the penalty of perjury that the government investigated Dr Haim with exceptional speed, you know, sending him a target letter within a month.

The prosecutor whom we spoke to admitted that she'd never even reviewed the evidence against Dr Haim and the initial investigation was premised on an easily disproved falsehood, which we explained to Congress. Before reviewing the evidence, the Department of Justice prosecutor asked Dr Haim to admit felony wrongdoing or wrongdoing to avoid a felony prosecution. It's very convoluted and even recognizing her limited understanding of the law, the prosecutor discussed aggressively prosecuting Dr Haim and she said this is because it's the families of the victims and the doctors who are the true victims of this, not the state of Texas or the children, you know, but it's the doctors who can't perform these surgeries. And so she labels the doctors performing the transgender medical interventions on minors and the hospital concealing these procedures as the true victims. She, she tried to insist that the Dr Haim had no right to blow the whistle, which is actually incorrect, and she even brought Dr Haim's wife into it. She's Dr Haim's wife is an attorney and she even brought Dr Haim's wife into it. She's in it, dr Haim's wife is an attorney. And when the HHS, the Department of Justice, came to their home, his wife said you know, you should invoke your Fifth Amendment rights and call a lawyer. And the Department of Justice essentially tried to accuse her of obstructing justice by doing that, which is completely outrageous behavior. And so this is very serious. And in Dr Haimes case, you know we'd explained to the prosecution all along you don't have a case, you don't understand the facts. They eventually indicted him four counts up to 10 years in prison.

We have been doing motion practice and learning more about the government's case and there was a big filing on Friday, which is it's a bombshell. The government sent us documents with evidence admitting that that admitting the evidence contradicts the allegations against Dr Hine. So they've now, you know, a year later, thanks to the motion, practice and us, pointing out holes in their arguments and asking for more information on what exactly they're trying to accuse our client of doing. They've admitted they have the facts and the law wrong, and so this is, you know, really outrageous. Up until Friday night, the government has insisted to the defense and to the judge that Dr Haim had zero reason to access Texas Children's Hospital medical records. Instead, what they've, you know, told us is that now they do have evidence that the government convinced a grand jury to indict Dr Haim without the FBI requesting a basic text search of his name inside the medical record system. So it looks like everything the government thought it knew about the case is wrong, and so we filed a motion this morning for a continuance that we need a lot more evidence. We need the hospital to participate more, we need to have a more forthright dialogue backed up with evidence, and you can't just drag our clients through this, the process being the punishment. You have to have a real case, and when we finally started getting traction, we're learning that their case is indeed falling apart, and so we're hoping getting traction. We're learning that their case is indeed falling apart and so we're hoping that they actually drop the charges. We don't know if that'll happen, but we've learned enough even in the past week about how weak the government's case is.

That, yeah, I mean just as a lawyer. You just kind of this is a once in a lifetime case. We actually were very hesitant to take it at first. We have a commercial law firm. We didn't have an intent to take big cases like this and the culture wars or anything.

But I have four boys and two of them were born at Texas Children's. And when I got the call about the case, I called my partners and it's like, listen, they're abusing kids at this hospital. If we don't take this case, who's going to take it? I actually tried to call a bunch of lawyers to see if someone else could take it, and no one else would touch it, and so we knew if we did this case, nobody would take it. So we took it and it's just grown and snowballed and it's you know, it's just it gets worse and worse. So we are scheduled for trial. It's trials in about four weeks in Houston and if the government doesn't drop these charges against our client, then we're going to go to trial and the jury is going to have to take a hard look and hopefully decide. You know, see things the way we do.

Rick Green

There's so much to unpack there, marcel, I cannot skip the fact that. Well, number one, thank you for even recognizing the weaponization of these agencies. You know, five years ago people like you and me, we would have said that's conspiracy theory. And you know we would have laughed people off that said that You've seen it happen. You know, same here, total wake-up call with what's been happening there.

And secondly, I cannot skip over the fact I think I heard you say you know there was essentially an intimidation factor from the prosecutor to try to force some sort of settlement or agreement which has been kind of the game plan of the DOJ in so many of these situations where they just come in and threaten and you know you can't fight City Hall and we got all the money. You know they don't say it that way, but that's obviously what you're thinking as the weight of the federal government is coming down on you. That is a travesty of justice in and of itself. And then, lastly, it's such evidence that they are ideologically driven. There's no longer this intellectual honesty for the law, and the fact that they would jump into it the way that they did not do their homework or even prosecute, even though the evidence was clear. It's just another indication of just how taken these agencies are, these DA offices around the country. It's just a sad, sad situation and it's going to take a lot of effort by people like you willing to do this because, like you said, a lot of your friends you called them and they didn't want to take the case, they don't want to touch it.

There aren't many willing to step up and if we love the law and we have a love of truth and even like with J6, look at all the video, find out who was actually doing bad things and who wasn't, instead of, you know, pox on all houses, we're going to just like they threatened the wife.

You know, you got a. You got a guy in jail right now for bending over to help a police officer that day and he's charged with assaulting a police officer for literally helping him. I mean that's the abuse of the, of the system that's happening, happening up and down the line. So I didn't mean to filibuster there, but, man, you said so many wise things that I just had to hit, hit, reiterate some of some of them for our audience. Where do we go from here in terms of just? You know, can't be just Texas Children. So is there, as you've been doing this case, have you been hearing about others or other attorneys that are taking on these cases? Like you know, it's going to have to be a private effort, because the government agencies are the ones that are taken.

Marcella Burke

Well it is. We do represent whistleblowers across the country. There are whistleblowers at two other major hospitals that we know about, and we represent both of them as well. So we've got four whistleblowers across the country at our law firm.

So the government. You know the law informs culture and it's used as a tool to teach, and when you prosecute someone, you're trying to punish the person, the perpetrator, but you're also serving to teach the public and you're informing the public to not do the thing, and so that's backfired. When Dr Haim went public, it actually set off a domino effect of people from across the country realizing what's happening. And when the FBI started investigating and when our clients went public with the weaponization of the Department of Justice, you know that actually emboldened other doctors and nurses. So what we hope to see is more whistleblowers coming forward. Don't be fooled by a scare tactic. At the end of the day, the law is on your side and the truth bats last. There are lawyers who will take cases by whistleblowers. These are great cases for people like me to take. I'll say that Dr Haim is in a pinch because it's incredibly expensive to defend yourself. We have three law firms representing him in tandem and he has to pay his bills. We're basically doing it low bono it's not pro bono, right. So he has a give send, go page set up and he has fundraised for this case. So if any of your listeners $5, $20, $1,000, right, whatever. We've had people donate up to $25,000, but most of his donors are twenty to one hundred dollars and it's it's incredibly encouraging for him but that really helps him because, at the end of the day, law firms can't take these cases totally pro bono. There are not organizations set up in the in the sort of any legal circle, conservative or not you hate to think it's a conservative issue, but they do seem to be targeting one one side of the aisle but there just aren't organizations set up that take white collar cases against you know, defending people who are being prosecuted. I mean this is a new phenomenon we're seeing in the Biden administration across different groups. You see J6, you see it outside of abortion clinics and now you see them prosecuting the transgender whistleblowers, and so the public prayers are incredibly valuable and donating to the Givesendgo page for Dr Haim or for Vanessa Sivadge that's. That's huge for them, because otherwise they're going to be paying back legal fees to different law firms for who knows how long. So that's another huge, huge thing.

I mean my firm's. Less than two years old. We started the firm a number of lawyers from top global law firms wanting to have a boutique where we didn't have to worry about sort of like woke ideology in our law firms, and instead, of course, we're taking on one of these major cases. But we're too small, we can't afford to not to do this for free. We're brand new. We actually took the case within months of opening the law firm. Seven people started it with me and that's part of why we thought we couldn't take it. We're too small, we're too new, we can't afford it. And so he's been fundraising to do it. We've known that God's got a lot of money, and so we have a planet, we have a whistleblower, we have lawyers and we have generous citizens who are willing to chip in.

Rick Green

I just cannot thank you enough for taking the case, for leading in this. Folks, you can go to GiveSendGocom and all you got to do is type in Dr Haim's last name. That's what I just did. I searched for H-A-I-M and it comes up immediately. It is absolutely something to give to Listen.

What Marcella's doing is essentially putting her firm on the line, putting her time on the line, working for way less. They'd much rather be doing what their other specialties are. And yet there's a call here. Freedom is on the line, the Constitution is on the line and patriots step up when that happens. And so, folks, you've got to help here. Go to Gifts and Go Search for Dr Haim H-A-I-M. Do whatever you can there to help this fight continue, because this will impact kids and hospitals and communities all over the nation. People are watching. You're exactly right, marcel. My friend Frank Turek always says it that way. The law is a great teacher, and that's exactly, it's so true. And the intimidation of the weaponization of these agencies is a great teacher. It makes people get silent unless they see people like you fighting back and winning. So this is critical, critical, critical. We'd love to have you back for an update. Please just know that we are praying for y'all and donating, and we appreciate you being on the front lines and taking this on.

Marcella Burke

Thank you for having us on your show and you know we want to keep the story going. It's a trial, so we have four weeks and we really appreciate that you continue to amplify Dr Hyman and Nurse Sivadge’s stories and thank you for all you're doing. Also very important to have your support.

Rick Green

Stay with us folks. We'll be right back with David and Tim Barton

Break

Rick Green

Welcome back to the WallBuilder. Show Thanks for staying with us and wow guys, David and Tim I you know I'm so thankful because sometimes we give not sometimes we always give lawyers a hard time, right, that's just like part of the fun. I learned more you know lawyer jokes in law school than you can imagine. But there's some heroes out there like this and usually I think of the think tanks and Kelly Shackelford and First Liberty, or Matt Staver and Liberty Council, Brad Dacus, pacific Justice here's a person that's actually practicing law, has a regular law firm and say we're going to take time, energy and money and go engage in this fight Really encouraging.

David Barton

And that's what we need to see from every citizen A to sacrifice life, fortune and sacred honor. Do what they can to help the Republic. This is an attorney doing it in the legal area, but every one of us need to do it in the political area through voting. And I'm going to go back to what we were talking about yesterday. If you're a person of faith, you cannot sit this one out. There's too much to say. You have to be there.

Tim Barton

And understanding too, when she pointed out that the DOJ acknowledged they were wrong about the facts, they were wrong about the law, and they still haven't dropped this. This is the weaponization we are seeing, this is the weaponization we're talking about and this is what we have to put a stop to. And we do that by getting engaged, getting involved and making sure we show up and vote, where we don't just vote one time and leave. We stay engaged in the process, keeping that John Quincy Adams thought in mind. That duty is ours, results are God's. We're going to show up and do the right thing.

Rick Green

Duty is ours, results are God's. That's the theme for today, for everybody. As we sign off, make sure that you're doing your duty, especially over the next few weeks. Engaged heavily, but even after the election of November. Folks, these are the kind of battles that are going to go on, and we are the ones that can make a difference in our community. So thanks for listening. Go out there, take action on it. Now You've been listening to the WallBuilders Show.