Rick Green: 0:12

This is the intersection of faith and the culture. It's WallBuilders. I'm Rick Green, America's Constitution Coach here with David Barton and Tim Barton. David, of course, America's premier historian and our founder at WallBuilders, Tim's national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. You can learn more about all three of us at WallBuilders.com . Alright, David and Tim, time to get into those questions from the audience. And there's some guy from in our audience named Rick Green that's going to ask the first question, and so I'm actually going to be...

David Barton: 0:37

Oh, wait a minute. I thought we did screening here. Don't we have better screening than that?

Rick Green: 0:41

We need a better screening process. How did this guy get through? All right, so I have a big question for you guys. But I really got to set it up. So I'm actually going to play some clips here. And of course, you know, as everybody knows, in the world, 48 hours ago, the District Attorney in Fulton County, which is basically Atlanta, in Georgia indicted almost 20 People with, you know, claims of conspiracy and racketeering, basically, mafia statutes were used to go after not only Donald Trump, but I mean, some of the best legal minds and scholars. John Eastman is well respected, in America as a legal scholar, he was indicted, Rudy Giuliani, I mean, all these people, all for questioning the outcome of the election, and asking that the constitution be followed, and that we just verify who actually won and whether or not the Constitution was violated in how some of the elections took place. Things that I asked for those things in 2020. But there's some interesting people that did similar. So we're going to just listen to some of these other, you know, well known people in American politics, and I'm sure they're on the list of indictments. But we'll cross reference and make sure so, thanks to our friends at One America News network for compiling this, here we go. This first one you might recognize her voice, but just in case you don't this would be former Senator Hillary Clinton.

Hillary Clinton: 2:01

Virginia just stopped using touchscreen computer voting because it's so vulnerable. We need to look at all the voting machines. Every secretary of state needs to be, you know, assisted in making sure that they are not being hacked and attacked.

Rick Green: 2:16

Now that was Hillary Clinton, guys, just want to make sure we understood what she said. She basically said, I'm gonna make you an offer you can't refuse. In other words, she's basically saying the state should say to the secretaries of state, meaning the government should say to them, you're going to do this our way because these voting machines are not reliable. We're afraid that they're being hacked. Hillary Clinton questioning. Okay, this is Adam Schiff Democrat by the way,

Adam Schiff: 2:37

I continue to think that our voting machines are too vulnerable.

Sheila Jackson Lee: 2:41

Researchers have repeatedly demonstrated that ballot recording machines and other voting systems are susceptible to tampering.

Rick Green: 2:48

I know that sounds like a guy, but that was actually Sheila Jackson Lee, Congresswoman from Texas. Yes, another Democrat. So Adam Schiff, Sheila Jackson Lee, here's another Democrat, this one from Florida, Val Demings, Congresswoman from Florida.

Val Demings: 3:00

Even hackers with limited prior knowledge, tools and resources, are able to breach voting machines in a matter of minutes.

Jennifer Wexton: 3:08

In 2018, electronic voting machines in Georgia and Texas deleted votes for certain candidates or switched votes from one candidate to another.

Rick Green: 3:15

That was Jennifer Wexton, another Democrat and then now we got Ron Wyden he's a senator from from Oregon, US senator from Oregon. This is pretty serious stuff, he's He's claiming here.

Ron Wyden: 3:26

Biggest seller of voting machines is doing something that violates cybersecurity 101 directing that you install remote access software, which would make a machine like that, you know, a magnet for fraudsters and hackers.

Rick Green: 3:40

Now what? I thought our friend Pat Colbeck, up in Michigan, senator that said that was possibly happening was you know, definitely a purveyor of false news and all those things. But here's, again, Representative Ted Lieu so another Democrat. this is Democrat from California, Ted Lieu.

Ted Lieu: 3:57

These voting machines can be hacked quite easily.

Amy Klobuchar: 4:01

You could easily hack into them. It makes it seem like all these states are doing different things. But in fact, three companies are controlling that.

Rick Green: 4:11

Now that was followed by... Ted Lieu was followed by senator from Minnesota, Amy Klobuchar, actually a presidential candidate, and she's questioning whether or not machines can be hacked, not just questioning, saying that they can be. So this next one is I think it's Congresswoman Kelly, another Democrat.

Robin Kelly: 4:31

It is the individual voting machines that... pose some of the greatest risk.

Kamala Harris: 4:37

a lot of states that are dealing with antiquated machines, right, which are vulnerable to being hacked.

Rick Green: 4:45

Now that now that voice you might have recognized, even though she didn't let us know that AI is two letters A-I, but that was vice president Kamala Harris while she was Senator from California. Again, hacking machines is all coming from Democrats back to Ted Lieu from California.

Ted Lieu: 5:01

Workers were able to easily hack into the electronic voting machine. It was possible to switch votes.

Ron Wyden: 5:07

43% of American voters use voting machines that researchers have found have serious security flaws, including backdoors.

Rick Green: 5:21

That was Senator Wyden, again from Oregon. Backdoors to voting machines. Again, this is Democrats questioning the election. Therefore, they must be conspirators. They must be, you know, some sort of mafia racketeering operation. This is Mark Warner from Virginia, another Democrat.

Mark Warner: 5:40

We know how vulnerable now our systems where. We know... I know, the hackathon that took place last year, where virtually every machine was broken into fairly quickly.

Kamala Harris: 5:49

I actually held a demonstration for my colleagues here at the Capitol, where we brought in folks who before our eyes, hacked election machines, those that are not... those that are being used in many states.

Rick Green: 6:04

And that was, of course, at the time, Senator Kamala AI Harris. Okay, AI may not be in her name. But again, I mean, these are leading Democrats. Okay, so David, Tim, my question for you... and I didn't even play all of them. There's a whole lot more clips. Leading Democrats questioning the integrity of our elections. Surely they are on the list of indictments out of Georgia. And my question for you on Foundations of Freedom Thursday is it unconstitutional, and should it be criminal to ask that elections be solid, and question if an election, whether or not there might have been some problems with it?

Tim Barton: 6:42

Well Rick, first, I want to point out that the Democrats were not questioning elections, per se. They were questioning Republicans winning elections, so a little different. You know, they weren't questioning whether Biden defeated Trump. That's what you can't question. You cannot question when a democrat wins. You.. So, they don't mind you asking questions. It's just you have to ask the right questions. And the question is can a Republican actually beat a Democrat? And no, in their mind it had to be cheating. That's the only way they could win. So that's when it's appropriate to question elections, just not when Joe Biden, the most popular president in American history, whose rallies were so big, that they had empty seats with, you know, only 80 People president, but no, like, don't question that. That's where you confused it.

Rick Green: 7:31

I get it, now. And the problem is my reading, I have problems reading because I've always read the first amendment, I thought it said, you know, that you cannot abridge the freedom of speech. I'm looking closer now. Or abridging the freedom of speech, if..., unless criticizing Democrats in elections, that... I forgot that that part was in there in the First Amendment, or maybe that amendment happened, and we didn't know.

David Barton: 7:54

Well, it is. It's really... you guys are acting like this is a surprise, look at the list of indictments, and they're clearly Democrats on there as well as Republicans. Well, maybe not. Maybe it's... Okay. All right, that is facetious. Clearly there were no Democrats that appeared on the indictment list. But yet the clips you played, some of those clips you played actually had stronger comments, than some of those that were indicted, at least the comments I've seen they're indicted for. You actually have Democrats saying things stronger, but because you pointed out and as Tim pointed out, the results of the election were different. We don't count that. We're just looking at you for questioning Democrats doing it. It's okay for Democrats to question Republicans, but you can't do the other thing. Now, this is really a throwback. And you know, this is kind of unprecedented in our era. But guys, if we go back to the Alien Sedition Acts of 1798, you had the same thing going on. The John Adams administration was crushing critics who were complaining about what John Adams was doing. So they passed the Alien Sedition Act. And it was supposedly to stop sedition from foreign incendiaries that were coming in from France and trying to stir up... the French were trying to stir up America against Great Britain and etc. And so they passed this Alien Sedition Act, but the only people that got indicted under it, and there were about two dozen people indicted under this federal law, they were all political critics of John Adams. It was not used to go after the French foreign agents that they talked about. It was used to go after Americans that disagreed with what the President's administration was doing. And, quite frankly, that, at that time, that resulted in a political party shift. That's what allowed Thomas Jefferson to come in and win the next election. He had been on the other side of that he was not in favor of those Alien Sedition Acts and trying to limit free speech and so it cost him one term. Now, I don't know that American voters are as aware of what's going on right now with these indictments, as they should be. They... a lot of people just get their news from, you know, sound bites and not really expressed. I think anybody who looked into what happened with those indictments and looked at the statements that were are being made that the indictments were issued for, I think they would back off and say, wait a minute, that... this is not good. This is not a good direction for the nation. But if you're listening to the national news, then it's all about incendiary Republicans trying to overthrow with violence, what happened in the election, which is not the case here.

Tim Barton: 10:16

It's also something that for people that are paying attention, there is some curious timing of these indictments coming down, where you're hearing information about the new Hunter Biden issue. And then the next day, Trump is indicted. And we've seen now with these four different indictments that have come down to this point, all of them have been around some significant things, blunders from Biden or issues with Hunter Biden and things that Democrats, almost it's like they want to distract us from some of the other major stories. And so right, how can the media change the storyline? How can we make sure we're not paying attention to some of these things? Well, let's indict Trump yet again. And we've seen what very well could be argued is misdirection from the media, from the Biden team. And Biden team, at this point, you could argue, including the DOJ, because when you look at David Weiss being selected as a special investigator in this Hunter Biden issue, and he was the US attorney who approved the deal from the DOJ with Hunter Biden, for the tax evasion, the tax fraud, to give him a little slap on the wrist, to say, hey, we won't bring any gun charges, and there will be no further charges for any maybe future issues that might arise where there's other crimes, like... no future charges are coming and this led the judge...

David Barton: 11:43

I wonder how many Americans get that same deal. We're going to to indemnify you against anything you do in the future. We don't know what you've done. But we're giving you a Get Out of Jail Free card for anything you do in the future. That, on its face, is unbelievable.

Tim Barton: 11:57

Well and right it also, to me tips their hand that they know there's more things waiting to be revealed about Hunter Biden. Maybe they actually found out whose cocaine was in the White House, right? Now, you know, who knows what else could be coming, regarding Hunter Biden, and the Biden family. All that to say, though, is people are beginning to realize, I think, that there is a level of corruption. When you even have just a week or so ago where CNN was even talking about some of the stuff going on with Hunter Biden, with David Weiss, it doesn't seem right. And I don't know yet that people are connecting the political targeting of Trump or some of these Republicans. I don't know yet that everybody's making those connections, with it being a politically motivated thing because the media for so long, has tarnished and stained Trump as not just an election denier, but with January 6, and all the narrative about that and violent overthrows etc, etc. He might be stained enough still, that people don't see this as a politically targeted or politically motivated targeting of Trump. But I think more and more people are waking up and more and more people are starting to ask questions and honest questions. And Dad, to your point, if they actually read what some of these accusations and indictments were, and then had an objective perspective to look at what Democrats have done, as we just heard some of those audio clips of various Democrat leaders over the last couple of years, challenging the validity of elections, which is what they're indicting Trump for in Georgia, certainly Americans would recognize this as a political hit job. It's not an honest effort to uphold justice.

Rick Green: 13:38

And I also want to make sure, you know, hey, listeners, we love to have fun here at WallBuilders. And so we, you know, are poking fun a little bit and laughing a little bit. But we also recognize how serious this is, this is a major... This is an undermining of the justice system. This is just a further reminder of a two tier justice system. And the idea that you can indict people, especially a former president, or these constitutional scholars, but anybody, any citizen for simply questioning an election, simply asking that the process be followed, simply saying, you know, the Constitution was violated in many of these states with the way they changed election law, for simply stating facts like that and asking questions. Man, that's the destruction of a system at that point. Because if you can't question an election, which I did in 1998, you know, you guys remember. I lost about 20 votes, we questioned the count. We said, hey, we want to have a recount, we just want to make sure, we didn't have to claim cheating to ask for verification. Nobody, anywhere that I know of asked for a reversal of an election. Nobody asked for an overturning of an election. What did we ask for? We asked for verification. We asked to make sure that only legal votes were counted and legal electors were counted. That's what everybody was asking for. And the idea that we're going to criminalize that is so dangerous for our country. It's a horrible road to go down. And we're raising all this, laughing about it a little bit so we can have joy while we're doing it, but we're saying this is a foundational issue that needs to be questioned.

David Barton: 15:00

Now, I want to go to another foundational issue is, if you had brought this evidence to one of the major prosecutors in Texas, you would not have gotten indictments. And this goes to the fact that one of the things that we've talked about for the last several elections is the way that people like George Soros have focused on down ballot races, like county DA's, focusing... and as you look at some of the top counties across the nation, the DA's are these Soros kind of people, whether it was St. Louis or whether it was Chicago, whether it was New York City, or whether it was Atlanta, whether it was Dallas, or Austin are all these other places. And the Soros kind of DAs... I have to go back to the biblical foundings, here, the biblical foundations, the Bible makes it really clear that there's right and wrong and there's law breakers and there's law keepers. And it's just such an easy passage that God sets forth. But He says, here's the things, you should punish people for, First Timothy One 8 through 10, if you're a murderer, if you're a perjurer, if you're a liar, these are kinds of things you punished for. And he points out how that what happens is, the purpose of government is to punish the wicked, and to reward the righteous. However, if you have a secular mindset, then you turn everything upside down. And those... and I'm going to call them religious values of fighting murder and fighting perjury, and all the things in the 10 commandments, that turns around and you say, well, those really aren't crimes. What's crime is criticizing something or we're going to let... there was a... one of our friends just won a case in Washington, DC, where that the federal court there said, hey, this is a bad deal. The courts have done more to punish pro life protesters outside abortion clinics than they did Black Lives Matter when they tried to burn down the city. And so you're going after pro life people, you're not going after actual violent criminals. And that's a reversal. And that's what happens when you start putting secular minded people into positions. If you don't have a basic biblical worldview, and I'm not saying you're an evangelical Christian, or you're a bible thumper, or you're an Orthodox Jew, that's not what I'm saying. If you don't have at least a biblical foundation of what's right and wrong, and we'd probably point to somebody like a Ben Franklin in the founding era that we don't think was a Christian, yet he still had that acceptance of what's biblically right and wrong. If you don't have somebody like that, you're going to get the results you're getting out of Atlanta right now out of what's happened with that prosecutor, you're going to get the same kind of indictments we're getting across the nation going after Trump. But they're not going to stop with just Trump, they're going to go after anybody who holds a philosophy different to their secularist. And I do... I don't use the term secular, I use the term secularist, because they're not just secular people. A lot of secular people are neutral on religion. A secularist is someone who's anti religious, and they are so pro secular. That's the religion they want to install. And that's what we're seeing with the Soros DAs. That's what we've seen. And quite frankly, we saw even this last week, where that DeSantis went in, and he is now removed to DA's out of their elected positions in Florida over large cities, because the Florida Constitution allows him to remove DAs who are practicing malfeasance, they're not prosecuting crimes, they're letting people out. They're having no bail. And no matter what your crime is, you get out free, no bail. And it's crazy stuff. But what we're looking at with Atlanta is the result of becoming more and more secularist minded, and letting Soros kind of people get in there who don't believe that the purpose of government is to punish the wicked and reward the righteous, they've got it reversed. They want to punish the righteous and reward the wicked. And we're seeing this happen before our eyes at a way that most of us never thought we'd see in our lifetimes in this free country.

Rick Green: 18:49

Well, it was so important you point this out in Constitution Alive, David, when you teach on the fact that Isaiah says, I'll give you lawyers as at the beginning, judges at the first, then you'll be the righteous city. And without that justice, without a biblical justice system with good lawyers, righteous lawyers, righteous attorneys, the whole system falls apart and we won't be the righteous city. So we've got to restore that. A lot of different things we can be doing, to do that. We're going to take a quick break. We'll be back in a moment. It's foundations of freedom Thursday on WallBuilders. Have you ever wanted to learn more about the United States Constitution, but just felt like man, the classes are boring, or it’s just that old language from 200 years ago, or I don’t know where to start? People want to know, but it gets frustrating because you don’t know where to look for truth about the constitution either. Well, we’ve got a special program for you available now called Constitution Alive with David Barton and Rick Green. And it’s actually a teaching done on the Constitution at Independence Hall in the very room where the constitution was framed. We take you both to Philadelphia, the cradle of liberty and Independence Hall and to the WallBuilders’ library, where David Barton brings the history to life to teach the original intent of our Founding Fathers. We call it the Quickstart Guide to the Constitution, because in just a few hours through these videos, you will learn the citizen’s guide to America’s constitution, you’ll learn what you need to do to help save our constitutional republic. It’s fun, it’s entertaining, and it’s going to inspire you to do your part to preserve freedom for future generations. It’s called Constitution Alive with David Barton and Rick Green. You can find out more information on our website now at WallBuilders.com. We're back here on WallBuilders. Thanks for staying with us on this Foundations of Freedom Thursday. Of course, the foundational freedom we're talking about today is justice, biblical justice in a good justice system that is blind, where you have equal justice, blind justice, not justice as based on which political party you're a part of, or the color of your skin or which religion you belong to. But treating everybody the same, honest weights and measures, the biblical justice that the... that we know God intended for us. And David, you hit this before the break. I mean, when we move away from the morals, when we move away from religion, we're going to lose all of that. The reason we have the best system in history was because the founders based it on a biblical idea of justice.

David Barton: 21:02

Yeah, and that biblical idea of justice is really getting away from us. We've talked in the last couple of weeks how that new polling is out that shows that America is more secular than it's ever been in its entire history, at least polling history as far as we can tell. But now on any given Sunday, there are more people out of church than are in church. And that has not been the practice in America for a long time. So even people who might only go to church once a quarter, it's just not happening anymore. The American Bible Society has pointed out that Bible readers in America have fallen. And they define a Bible reader as someone who reads the Bible three times a year. In other words, you crack the Bible once every four months. That's a low standard, but they call you a Bible reader if you do that, and we've lost 25 million 2 years ago and 3 million last year that no longer even crack the Bible once every three months. So we've become more secular than we've ever been, we know less about foundational, logical truths. Again, you don't have to be an orthodox, Christian, bible thumper, anything else to recognize that what the Bible says about what's crime and what's not crime and what law enforcement people should punish and shouldn't punish. I mean that's been part of the Western tradition for a long time. It's biblically based. But the more secularist you become, the less you understand that. And this is why it's so important. This is why for years, we've worked with so many various groups, including the Blackstone Fellowship, which is young attorneys, or people who are going into the law, who are in their second year of law school, but working with Alliance Defending Freedom, to get those biblical foundations back into people who practice the law, who understand the underpinnings of the law. This is why we work, Rick, as you do, with Patriot Academy. So many of these kids are going to end up going in the legislature or they're going to go into some staff role, some support position, maybe judiciary committee or something else. And they've got to understand what the purpose of law is, what rights and wrongs, how we define that and what that means. And so this is something that if the church and if Christians don't pay attention to what happens in local elections, and that means sheriff, and that means constables, and that means your mayors and your DAs and all these other things. I mean, those are super important positions. And they've been considered down ballot positions, but look at what's happening now across the nation. And I have to point out that some people are just following the information they hear, they've not researched it, they've not studied it. And so because you might be following some of this progressive woke kind of law stuff, doesn't necessarily mean you hate America, it just means you're hanging around with people getting information from sources where they don't like America. And so there's a lot of people in America who are getting the information from better than good sources. But nonetheless, it all comes back to judging a tree by its fruits. And the fruits we're seeing right now out of the justice system, are not the ones that we need to be seening when you go back to historical standards and biblical standards. And I think it's really important that we get back to understanding that biblical view of law.

Tim Barton: 24:03

Well, and this is also too where understanding, reminding people again, the reason we have the due process clauses in the Bill of Rights goes back, arguably, to all the way back to kind of the Plymouth area when you have what was known as the witch trials. And people look at the Puritans and what they did. And the reason the witch trials came to an end to America after approximately a year and a half, approximately 27 people that died during the witch trials, 19 that were executed, 8 that died in prison awaiting their trial, awaiting their sentence. During that time, there were Christian leaders who went to the governor and said, Governor, do you understand what these judges are doing? Specifically, Judge Sewall is one of those judges. Do you understand what he's doing? Because he's not allowing these people accused of a crime to call witnesses in their defense, which is clearly a biblical position that... He's not allowing them to actually give testimony in their own defense, in fact he's taking hearsay testimony. He's not requiring that there be at least two eyewitnesses to the overt act which is what the Bible says, you have to have at least two witnesses before the death penalty. And Governor Phips goes to judge Sewall, and they end up putting an end to these trials. Well that very notion that those Christian leaders came to the governor and argued became the foundation for the due process clauses in the Bill of Rights. The reason you get to confront your accuser and call witnesses in your defense. And the reason that the standard for the death penalty in America always was there had to be at least two eyewitnesses. And this is the traditional standard. It's because of what the Bible said. So as we talked about restoring justice, it's also worth noting, you can't restore justice in the American system, without restoring a basic understanding of the Bible and biblical values, which is where it really comes back to us as Christians, making sure that we get back to the Bible, spend time in the Bible, and then apply the Bible to how we live life so that we can restore justice back to the American system of justice, truth, justice, the American way, the only way we restore that is getting back to the Bible.

Rick Green: 25:58

And it's incumbent upon all of us to do that. We all need to get educated on these things, then we need to choose leaders that do and the good news is, you know it's like David said, we've got graduates of Patriot Academy and these various programs that are now elected as judges and congressmen and things like that. So we can do this, it's going to take some more effort, we're going to have to concentrate on it more, we need to encourage people to go into those arenas with their biblical worldview and not have a negative, you know, where we keep people from running for office or going into the military into those things, because we're afraid those places are evil. We need biblically minded people to go into each of those areas and take godly principles. Out of time folks, foundations of freedom Thursday today, thanks for joining us. You've been listening to WallBuilders.