Tim Barton
Welcome to the WallBuilders Show. You have found your way to the intersection of faith and the culture, where we look at everything going on in the world around us with the lens from a biblically constitutional and a historic perspective. My name is Tim Barton. I'm the president of WallBuilders. I am joined today with my dad in studio. My dad is the founder of WallBuilders, David Barton. He's also known as America's Historian Generally. We will have Rick Green with us.
He's not been able to join us for this series. It's no problem, it's the nature of us traveling. We go different directions all the time, but we are in the middle, actually the end, of a series we've been airing on the program. It is a Memorial Day special and of course, Memorial Day was on Monday. We are now a couple of days past that but the special that we filmed for TV had some really significant interviews and history and content. And so, even though we're past Memorial Day, we recognize that most Americans just haven't heard a lot of the history and the stories that are significant, that have helped America become who we are and why do we do what we do. And at WallBuilders we always want to take time to help teach people, walk people through those stories and, Dad, today we had the chance actually more than one occasion to meet Edgar Harrell, and his story is one of the most sombering, harrowing stories I've ever heard from anyone, military or otherwise, ever.
David Barton
Yeah, Edgar is a World War II survivor of the greatest naval disaster, single naval disaster, in American history. There were more people killed in this incident than any other naval incident. And this was a ship that was taking the atomic bomb to Saipan to use to end World War II in Japan. So they delivered the bomb to Saipan. Now the ship is on their way back and they get torpedoed on their way back. It hit in such a crucial spot in the ship that the ship sank faster than they could get a radio distress signal off, that the ship sank faster than they could get a radio stress signal off.
So Edgar will go through the story today, of all the days they had at sea, of the massive loss of life as a result of this. This is a historic part of the war. This is what helped bring it into World War II. But Edgar's personal story this is absolutely amazing and if you're interested you can go on the website at WallBuilders. You can get this series. It's called America's Hidden History. This is year one, volume one, and this deals with the American holidays and that's what we're covering here in this third and final program honoring Memorial Day.
Tim Barton
All right, so we will go to the interview. You will hear Edgar Harrell today. This is the, as dad mentioned, the third and final installment.
And we'll catch you guys after this section.
David Barton
Ed Harrell is a veteran from World War II. He is a survivor of the single largest loss of life in any single ship in American history. His ship, the USS Indianapolis, was sunk in World War II. It's a very significant event that ship was part of and a very significant story that Ed has to tell us. We were recently with Ed in Tennessee. Here's his story.
We're in Clarksville, Tennessee. We're at the home of veteran Edgar Harrell from World War II. Thank you for inviting us into your home. You were part of World War II. You were on the USS Indianapolis, which is the single greatest loss of life for any single ship in naval history. How old were you at the time?
Ed Harrell
Well, I volunteered for the Marine Corps when I was 17 years old. I'm already in the Marines for a period of time before the sinking of the Indianapolis, which happened July 30, 1945.
David Barton
Help us put in perspective what the Indianapolis, which happened July 30, 1945.
Help us put in perspective what the Indianapolis was about, what it was doing. What's the overall picture of the Indianapolis?
Ed Harrell
Well, of course much, much more than just taking the atomic bomb over. When I went aboard, of course, I went to Saipan, Tinian Guam. I was at Okinawa where we received a kamikaze plane and lost several boys and because of that we had to come back to the States for repair.
And then, after repair, then we get the top secret cargo, then
David Barton
we know from history that it was predicted that if we had to invade Japan, it would cost millions of lives. And so what you guys did with the Indianapolis, to take the atomic bomb over, which is the one that you carried over,
Ed Harrell
Little Boy,
David Barton
little Boy. So that was the first one that was dropped. That was the first to drop at Hiroshima. That's what you were carrying at the first one that was dropped. That was the first to drop at Hiroshima. That's what you were carrying at the time in the Indianapolis.
Ed Harrell
That and half the uranium that America owned at that time
David Barton
Wow.
So you successfully delivered all the stuff for the atomic bomb. As you come back the night you get hit, you're sleeping under the turret out on the first turret on the deck. Within 12 minutes the ship is gone.
Describe those 12 minutes because you were sound asleep and then 12 minutes later there's no ship anymore,
Ed Harrell
since we had delivered our cargo, captain McVeigh came on the speaker at the change of the watch in the evening and said you're welcome to come topside and sleep right out on the open deck.
I made my pallet and then that first torpedo. Then I just knew that the bow of the ship was cut off. And then the second one then was back close to a number two turret and the magazine under the turret exploded and went through the top of that turret and you could feel and hear all of that water coming in below deck. Those four big screws are still pushing, pushing, pushing and you could just nearly know that something down below is happening. Well, it's the bulkheads down there just caving in. And before I could get back midship of my emergency station, the first hundred yards, the ship is under it's listing to the starboard, so that normally the quarter deck would be eight feet above the waterline but there's water on the quarterdeck, and we know that the ship is sinking. But finally word then trickles down, it's like an echo abandoned ship, abandoned ship. And you could nearly see it coming down and hear it, different ones from different stations.
Break
Ed Harrell
I'm holding on to the rail and I oftentimes say you know, there's times when you pray and there's times when you pray and I'm praying. I knew to whom I was praying to and I tell him I you know, I don't want to die. Mom and dad back home, six younger brothers older sister, the younger sister and a certain brunette that said that she would wait for me. I don't say that the Lord spoke to me, that I could hear audibly, but I knew he was talking to me. I could hear the words I'll never leave you, nor forsake you. Peace I give unto you, not as the world giveth. Give unto you. Let not your hearts be troubled, don't be afraid. And with that just ringing in my ears, nearly I knew that the Lord was speaking to me. I'm going to make it. I certainly didn't know I'm going to be out there another nearly five days, but I climbed over the rail and jumped into the water feet first. My K-Buck jacket came up over my head and I make my way then out to the first group.
Out there, many injured. We're losing boys every little bit because of injuries. And then daylight comes and you can look out at any time and you could see a big fin out there going around and, in fairness to the sharks, they weren't attacking us, but just let someone get out by himself. And every little bit you'd see a straggler out there and all of a sudden you'd hear a blood curdling scream and you'd see that body go under and then, like a fish cork, that Cape Hawk would bring it to the surface.
Now he's gonna be with you, though in that hot, sunny weather. He may be with you the next five days At 110 degrees sun. You're bareheaded and you're swimming. Old saying is decomposing with you and they're bumping into you, leaving that residue on you. You're desperate for water. The second day, when we were so thirsty that boys would dare to drink salt water, they'd tear off some of their clothing and put some water up in a piece of cloth, put their head under it and drink some salt water. But within the hour you could nearly time it. Within the hour they don't know straight up.
And here we are, down all maybe 25 or 30 boys that are gone out of the 80 now. But now.
David Brton
So in your group there's 80.
Ed Harrell
80 in my group just in your group, that's right word didn't get off the ship. They would say that we had received a torpedo. But we saw something out there and it appeared to be a little raft and of course you holler, they back at you and it is log. Until that little raft got close enough, we could see that there were five sailors around that raft and as they came in we could see no one is on the raft, but five sailors around it. Well, what was on the raft? The one thing that we desperately needed, which was a k-pop life jacket. They had taken k-pop jackets off of boys, already expired. The first thing they tell us take off your K-POC jacket and we take it off and two boys would squeeze that opposite direction, put it up on that raft. That 110 degrees Sun is drying that old K-POC out. So here we are. Now we're in the fourth day morning. I don't know where the raft is, I've drifted away from that and now there's debris everywhere out there and again we see those B-29s at 30,000 feet, but no one's looking for us.
And then I look at this one sailor and I saw in him what I had seen so many do and I went over and shook him because his head was dropping in the water. He raised up but he could nearly care less. The second time I did that and he's still alive. The third time it's too late. So it's just McKissick and myself. And then all of a sudden I can hear it today, all of a sudden. Look, look, I see a plane, I hear a plane and I could hear a plane. And I looked and looked and look, lieutenant Gwynne, flying that Ventura I call it a B-25, with wheels on it, flying out of Paloo. He had been up some 5,000 feet. He's having trouble with his radio antenna. He calls the co-pilot. He said take over control. I'm going to go aft and pull in my radio antenna. That the stabilizer on that had come off and he was going to put a sock or something on it.
But as he turned it over to the co-pilot and goes aft, he looks through the bomb bay door and he glances down at the water. He saw the oil on that water. The sun hit that and that told Lieutenant Gwynn. There's a jammed sub down there. He loaded his bombs.
He's coming in on a bombing run. We see him. Look, he's coming in. We're waving, splashing. But when he gets down under 500 feet or so he sees boys as far as his eyes could take him. And later he said you were scattered over 25 miles.
But I see him today as he came down over McKissick and myself, he circled. I can see him today in that cockpit. He said I know you're down there, don't know who you are. But he goes back up and he has to go up five to seven thousand feet before his radio would reach back at Paloo. And he does so. And he announced ducks on the pond. He gives them our coordinates. He gets a hold of Adrian Marks, a pilot of a PBY. Mark says we're gassed up, we're ready to come. I have the location out there. He says he saw more sharks than he saw boys and they set that big goose down. When I say they set it down, I saw it when it came down. And you talk about putting a plane in a stall, that tail was down as they're holding those twin engines up. But that tail caught on a swell and pinched the plane. One engine, one motor would never run again. So he's only got one prop now and all he can do is run the swells and pick up tractors.
Break
Ed Harrell
He came down my trough and they just throw out something for me to grab a hold of. I came out of my K-BAR jacket and they drug me in the plane and I might just say they picked up 56. Well, if you know anything about the fuselage of the PBY, you would say it won't hold 56. It will if you tie seven out on the wings. He can't take off. All he can do is wait for the Doyle to come in, and when the Doyle comes in they take us out of the plane.
They took me aboard that destroyer and took me below deck and gave me a kerosene or a diesel fuel bath to get that oil off. But any place nearly where your flesh had rubbed now it's just rotten. And when they clean that off, then blood, blood, blood. And what can you put on it? Well, would you like to be wrapped in Vaseline gauze? That's what they were doing to me, basically. And then from there, then I cut your hospital ship then and I came to Guam. There on the 6th of August there was a gentleman here that was from the like, the Louisville Courier Journal. He said hey, marine, did you know what that cargo was that you were guarding? No, sir, we didn't know. He said, you know, today, Hiroshima, and then there's a four-star Admiral Spruitz that came in and he sat on the cot next to me and talked to me and pinned the Purple Heart on me.
David Barton
When the Admiral put that Purple Heart on you, all you've been through you're just fresh out of the water those five days in the water what went through your mind when he put that Purple Heart on you?
Ed Harrell
I learned to respect him for all that. I could imagine that he's having to go through all the battles all over the Pacific we're losing boys by the thousands, literally thousands every day and that I could see him. And then, when now he's pinning that purple heart on me, he wished me Godspeed and something like that and thanked me for everything and he saluted and I couldn't salute back to him. Okay, but I can see it. Yeah. I can see it today
David Barton
Yeah, I can see it today Talking about these guys right here. These were in the Marines on the Indianapolis. Which ones made it?
Ed Harrell
Okay, mccoy and this guy Offerman, and down here, hughes and Rich and Ed Harrell right here. There's what's that? That's five Out of that. Whole group made it. Yeah, oh, like Spooner and Reagan, yeah, and that one, and those just came aboard but after the picture was made. Okay.
David Barton
And so these are the Marines that made it.
Ed Harrell
Those are the nine Marines that made it. All of them are gone. I'm the last's still alive.
Break
Mark Durfee
My name is Mark Durfee. I was in the United States Army. Memorial Day to me means what my grandfather sacrificed. He was taken POW by the Germans on 12-44. Between his sacrifice and the sacrifice of my third great-grandfather, Elias Durfee made it through Antietam, Gettysburg and the wilderness, only to die in a Confederate POW camp with three small children at home. Their sacrifice and their service inspired me to go serve as well, and that's what Memorial Day means to us.
Sarah Compton
My name is Sarah Compton and I am the surviving spouse of First Sergeant Jonathan Compton. Memorial Day has always had a great significance in our family, even when my husband was living, but even more so now that he's gone. And here now, in the metroplex area, we um honor my husband. There's a um a walk. We carry the load um, and we carry Jonathan with us everywhere
Kyle Rodgers
I was in the for five years. I worked as a hospital corpsman. I went to Afghanistan twice with 3rd Combat Engineer Battalion and naturally because of that there's a handful of men that I know personally that aren't with us anymore. All the celebrations, and you know, just take the time to, you know, raise a toast to them, tell a funny story about one of them and go on enjoying the liberties you know that I get to enjoy now that they don't get to anymore.
Tim Grunst
Well, my name is Tim Grunst. I'm a retired Air Force. Memorial Day means for me is it's time to spend with our family, to remember all those that have given their lives in the past for the freedoms that a lot of Americans take for granted these days. It's just a time for remembrance. Allow us to spend time together as a family and to get together and just enjoy the freedoms that we have in America.
Darrell Densford
I'm Darrell Densford. I'm an active duty Army chaplain and one of the things we live by, we nurture the living, we care for the fallen or the wounded and we honor the dead or the fallen. And one of the things that I try to do as a chaplain, and one of the things I recommend anybody do on Memorial Day, is just remember. So, whether you go to a national cemetery, whether you have a picnic with your family and cook out, just take a moment and remember the sacrifice of those who have fallen.
Brian Heitman
My name is Brian Heitman. I'm a retired US Army Airborne Infantryman with six combat tours. Memorial Day is a very difficult time for me because I did lose many guys over there and I spend Memorial Day honoring their memory. But I want Americans to enjoy the day, because that's why we fought.
Rex King
I'm Rex King. I'm a Navy veteran, combat disabled, vietnam. Both my parents served in World War II and, knowing what I know from Vietnam and the number of letters I had to write home, we are honoring those who served by building Gold Star family monuments all over the United States.
David Barton
Today we've uncovered some truly remarkable history. We now know that God's hand was involved in every aspect of Brian Birdwell's survival. We know that the highly controversial atomic bombs used to end World War II took less lives than the enemy slaughtered by hand. And we also know that dramatic events and saved lives are often the result of the little guys, the unsung heroes, who serve our country. What we've seen and heard only scratches the surface, so for more information about any of today's topics, I invite you to discover even more hidden history at our website, wallbuilders.com, or you can go to the app store on your smart device and download the WallBuilders app, and you can also go to our Wall Builders Facebook page and like us there, and be sure to stay tuned to TBN for more exciting chapters in America's hidden history.
Tim Barton
Okay, we want to thank you guys for joining us today. As you heard from these interviews and hopefully you've been listening the last three days. If not, I encourage you go get the last two episodes. It's been a three-part series and actually this was a TV show we did, and so if you actually want to see these individuals we're interviewing, you can see the face-to-face conversation. You can go to wallbuilders.com. Look for America's Hidden History and this is just one of the holidays that we focus on telling the stories from America's Hidden History, season 1. We have a Season 2 where we focus more on people than on holidays. There's so much information for all this and way more. Go to wallbuilders.com for all of your American history needs. We'll talk to you guys tomorrow.
